Interview with Glenn Greathouse, August 28, 2008

SMITH: Okay. This is Kim Lady Smith. Okay, that's too hot. Turn that down a little. This is Kim Lady Smith. And today is August 28th, 2008 and I'm at the home of Glenn Greathouse in Lexington, Kentucky, interviewing him for the Horse Industry in Kentucky Oral History Project at UK. So, Mr. Greathouse, if we-- to get started, if you can tell me your full name and when and where you were born.

GREATHOUSE: My name is Glenn K. Greathouse. I was born in Minneapolis, Minnesota.

SMITH: Oh, a long ways away. And what-- when were you born?

GREATHOUSE: Uh, January 19th, 1929.

SMITH: Okay. (both laugh) I've interviewed a couple folks that were born in 1929, so. Um, Minnesota. So, uh--

GREATHOUSE: Um-hm.

SMITH: --your family was from there?

GREATHOUSE: Uh, my mother's family was from there. My dad was born here in-- in, uh, uh, Scott got--Scott County. Uh, moved here when I was three years old. Being the Depression babe--baby, my dad lost his job up there and, uh, came to Midway, Kentucky to work with his brother on a dairy farm.

SMITH: Okay, is that what your fat-, father's occupation was?

GREATHOUSE: Um-hm. And, uh--

SMITH: And what was his name, before I forget?

GREATHOUSE: Ben Greathouse.

SMITH: Okay. Okay, so you came back to Kentucky.

GREATHOUSE: And I stayed in Midway, uh, until I was twelve years old. And then we moved on the Leestown Pike on the corner of Leestown and Valley Pike.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: It-- and, uh, went through high school there. And graduated 00:02:00from high school in 1948.

SMITH: Now do you have, um, brothers and sisters?

GREATHOUSE: I have, uh, two sisters.

SMITH: Okay. How do you fall in this?

GREATHOUSE: I, I am in the middle. (Smith laughs) I have a sis-, a sister that's seven years older and a sister that's two years younger than I.

SMITH: Okay. Now, um, up until you--when you moved, did your father continue to work on the dairy farm?

GREATHOUSE: Yes.

SMITH: Okay. Do you know why you moved to Lexington? Was it--

GREATHOUSE: Why we moved to Lexington from Midway?

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: Uh, at that time his brother had a, uh, a larger dairy farm on the Leestown Pike where the, uh, they did their own pasteurizing and delivering milk at that time. And, uh, it was, uh, during the war 00:03:00years too. And, uh, of course so many of the young men were just gone to war, World War II.

SMITH: Um-hm, um-hm. Hmm. So, when you were twelve years old, where would--where did you go to school for high school?

GREATHOUSE: I went to, uh, Linlee--

SMITH: Um-hm. How do you--Linlee?

GREATHOUSE: L-i-n-l-e-e.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: Lincoln and Lee.

SMITH: Oh, okay. (laughs)

GREATHOUSE: And it closed this year.

SMITH: Really?

GREATHOUSE: After I don't know how many years, uh, built a new school and it's-- it closed.

SMITH: Um, now I know we've talked before that you went to school with, uh, several people that are, uh, have worked in the industry. Who were some of your, some of your friends then?

GREATHOUSE: Oh, well, Henry White, he graduated from Lafayette in 1947. And, uh, Ed Fallon graduated in '49. Ercel Ellis I think graduated in 00:04:001949. Dan Midkiff Jr. graduated in '49. And Henry Waits, the manager of Hamburg Place, graduated in either 1949 or 1950. So there were quite a few of us. Most of us that graduated from Lafayette at that time were raised on the farm.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: There were two high schools in Fayette County at that time, Henry Clay and Lafayette. We considered Henry Clay the city school and Lafayette the county school.

SMITH: Okay. So you were at, at Lafayette, is that right? Is that what you said? Okay. And, um, now you had been raised then on a dairy farm, not a horse--

GREATHOUSE: Um-hm.

SMITH: --farm. What was your earliest experiences with horses?

GREATHOUSE: My earliest experience, uh, when I graduated from high school I, uh, was raising tobacco on a coup-, a couple of the horse farms. And one of 'em was Meadowcrest Farm, which was a, a hundred 00:05:00acre piece of land that was cut out of Hamburg Farm. It was actually part of Hamburg Farm. It was right--it, it was on the Winchester Pike and Hume Road. And, uh, the, the second year I was farming there, Mr. Maxwell, who was, uh, the owner of the farm, came to me and said that his foreman that was taking care of the horses had left and wanted to know if I would take care of 'em for a, a few days while they found a new man to take care of the horses. Well I was there--(laughs)--five years and he never found anybody. (Smith laughs) So that was how I got introduced at the age twenty into the horse business.

SMITH: Now when you graduated from high school, what were your plans? What did you want to do?

GREATHOUSE: I wanted, I wanted to farm.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, I went to vocational agriculture at, at Lafayette. And, uh, just, uh, enjoyed farming, enjoyed being outside.

SMITH: Okay. But you--

GREATHOUSE: But for--it was just an interesting twist that, uh, I got involved with the horses.

SMITH: So you hadn't had any experience with horses and suddenly you were responsible for 'em?

GREATHOUSE: Right. And I think if it hadn't a been for Mr. John Bell, who happened to be leasing three hundred acres right next to Meadowcrest Farm, he was leasing it from Hamburg Farm, and he and his farm manager, Andy Curd, I worried 'em to death because I also inherited the, the management of it right during the breeding season. (both laugh) And, uh, didn't know what I was doing. But, uh, being right next door to Mr. Bell was just the best thing that happened because he was so helpful. I'd go over and tell him my, my problems and things. And 00:07:00he'd either send one of the workers or even came over himself several times just to help me out and to see how, how I was doing. And, uh--

SMITH: About how many horses were you caring for?

GREATHOUSE: I had about, uh, seven broodmares, three or four weanlings, and four or five yearlings. So about twelve to fifteen at the very most.

SMITH: Did you have--how much help did you have?

GREATHOUSE: None. (Smith laughs) I, I was there, uh, and that was, quote, one of the things that thinking back now that was really frightening was to be there by yourself working with horses.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: Because the owners, they, uh, they went to Florida all winter and, uh, I was really there by myself. And, uh, it could, it could get dangerous.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: But having, like I say, Mr. Bell next door and, and some other people around, it, it kind of helped. But, uh--

SMITH: Do--what'd you think about working with horses at that point? Did you like it?

GREATHOUSE: Well, anytime you start out with something new you're intimidated. And when I got so I could, could handle horses and, uh, get around them, and I think I had a good way with 'em. I--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --learned, learned to be gentle with 'em and, and, uh, got along, got along very well until, uh, I started to groom my first sales yearling. And then of course I went right back to Mr. Bell--(laughs)- -and his help to show me how to groom and everything. So it was, it was just a wonderful experience and, uh, part of really when you think about it, it helped me when I did start my apprenticeship--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --which I started in 1955 with--

SMITH: So now--

GREATHOUSE: --with, with Gale, Galen Pelster.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: Who had worked with George Tompkins and, uh, was drafted and was in the Korean conflict and came back.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, he said he needed some help. And I told him I'd try it for three months. And, uh, if I didn't like it I'd come back. If I did, I'd stay.

SMITH: Now were you still working at the--

GREATHOUSE: No, I, I--

SMITH: --farm?

GREATHOUSE: --I resigned from there. And, uh, and then I--but I did, after my experience with what I went through, I agreed to come back- and-forth for a, a month to help this young man with--to get started a little bit.

SMITH: Um-hm. Okay.

GREATHOUSE: And, um--

SMITH: Now when you left, did you think you'd be interested in being a blacksmith?

GREATHOUSE: Yes. I found it, found it challenging and interesting and, 00:10:00um, hard work. Very hard work.

SMITH: Had you done some of that while you were at the farm or did you work with--

GREATHOUSE: No.

SMITH: --someone?

GREATHOUSE: None, none whatsoever. I just, uh, held for the, for the, the shoer and things like that and talked to him about it. And he told me what to do, to keep the feet in good condition and things like that. But as far as doing any kind of shoeing I had, I had no experience at all.

SMITH: Um-hm. Do you remember who was doing the shoeing, um, at the farm?

GREATHOUSE: Uh, Gale was.

SMITH: Oh, he was?

GREATHOUSE: Yes.

SMITH: Oh, okay, okay.

GREATHOUSE: Um-hm. And, uh, we, we had a real good relationship and I actually stayed with him for ten years.

SMITH: Now was he-- I'm not sure how this worked. Was he associated with the farm or was he an independent blacksmith?

GREATHOUSE: He was independent. Uh, he traveled from farm to farm. And, uh, it was difficult at that time--it's always difficult to get 00:11:00a horseshoer to work on a small farm because it's time consuming and everything, and coming out for a dozen horse, uh, I was lucky to get him. But he was just, as I say, coming back from the service and he was--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --uh, picking up work on different farms. And, uh, he, he'd fit me in and we had a good, good relationship and he did real good work.

SMITH: Um-hm. Now was--uh, I apologize 'cause I don't, don't know this. But was he African-American or was he an African-American or--

GREATHOUSE: No, no.

SMITH: --was he white? He was white?

GREATHOUSE: Um-hm.

SMITH: Okay. Okay. Were most of the blacksmiths at that time, say in the fifties, uh, were there a lot of African-Americans or--

GREATHOUSE: Yes there were--

SMITH: --was there a mixture? Okay.

GREATHOUSE: --a lot.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: I would say, when I started there were about, um, fifteen, maybe farriers in the Lexington, quote, area, of Lexington.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, at least half of 'em were African-American.

SMITH: Okay. Okay. Now, uh, okay, so you said you'd worked with him for, as an apprentice for a few months. How'd that go?

GREATHOUSE: Uh, after I got through with the soreness--(laughs)--and learning how to move around the horse, uh, I decided this is what I wanted to do as the rest of my life.

SMITH: What did you like about it?

GREATHOUSE: Uh, getting on different farms, learning how different people handle horses, how they feed horses and, uh, just meeting people. (coughs)

SMITH: It's okay.

GREATHOUSE: (coughs) Um, being on a farm by yourself for five years you get--(laughs)--you just, you pick up a lot of knowledge--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --from, from seeing how different, uh, farms operate.

SMITH: Now 1955, what were some of the farms you would have gone to?

GREATHOUSE: Uh, some of the farms, uh, were, uh, uh, Fayette Farm, which was on the Georgetown Pike.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, then we worked at Walnut Hall and Walnut Hall Stud. Walnut Hall Stud is where the Kentucky Horse Park is now. And then we worked at King Ranch. Uh, and then a couple of years after I started we worked for the Hurstland Farm, Nuckols Brothers, in Midway.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: (coughs) I'm awful sorry.

SMITH: No, that's okay. Would you like to stop and get some water? Okay.

[Pause in recording.]

SMITH: Okay. All right. We're back on. Um, now the farms you, you'd said something a little earlier that, uh, um, Mr. Pelster worked with Standardbreds as well as Thoroughbreds.

GREATHOUSE: That's correct.

SMITH: Was that unusual at that time? Or was that typical--

GREATHOUSE: Uh--

SMITH: --that you would work with both?

GREATHOUSE: Yeah, it was a little bit unusual. Uh, most of the-- so many of the farriers either worked at Standardbred farms or Thoroughbred. But, uh, I learned a lot about shoeing Standardbreds. Uh, their gait, of course, is different. You--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --they're trotters, pacers. Shoe 'em different. You balance 'em different. And, uh, it helped with, with the Thoroughbreds.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh--

SMITH: Now did, um, I see in the paper there that there was a, a trotting track shop. Did-- now did some of the blacksmiths--I'd saw--heard this in Jackie Thompson's interview. Was there a, uh, an area at the red mile or the trotting track where the blacksmiths had a shop? Was that--

GREATHOUSE: George Tompkins had a shop on the, on the track grounds.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, he had a couple of forges there. And, uh, a lot of times we would come in and use one of his forges if we had to make a shoe, or just to get him to help us with a special shoe--(laughs)--that maybe we had--we were having trouble with. And, uh, and it kind of a meeting place for the other farriers. We'd around there and, and visit and share some stories and some problems.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: And it was kind of a close knit, uh, group.

SMITH: You said there were about fifteen.

GREATHOUSE: Yeah, fifteen or sixteen, I think, uh, what I would think about right now. This is--

SMITH: --who were some of the others?

GREATHOUSE: --this was before it got too large. Uh, Dennis Murphy.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: Uh, and, uh, Charlie Hodges.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: Uh, of course, I, Jackie Thompson, uh, John Madison.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: Uh--

SMITH: Now did most of these blacksmiths, uh, have apprentices working with them?

GREATHOUSE: Have?

SMITH: Well, uh, have someone like you learning?

GREATHOUSE: They had apprentices, yes they did. Yeah, they, they, they would-- they all had, uh, helpers, and, uh--

SMITH: Is that how you learned to become a--

GREATHOUSE: Yes, the-- as far as schools went, uh, there weren't any. 00:17:00There are some schools now that you can go to and--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --uh, get the fundamentals out of the way, a lot of forge work and this and that. And then you go on and-- yeah, try to find a journeyman that'll take you on and, of course, finish out your apprenticeship. But back in the fifties there--mostly you, you learned through, through your journeyman.

SMITH: Did you have to have a--get a license?

GREATHOUSE: No, there was no--there's and there still is none required.

SMITH: Really?

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, there, uh, there are, there is the AFA does have a certification, uh--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --program that you can be certified through the AFA. But as far as license are concerned there, there, there is none.

SMITH: Okay. Okay, is that a, is that a good thing? Is that okay that there--

GREATHOUSE: Yes and no, because, uh, certification could mean are you 00:18:00certified for the track shoeing? Are you certified for the farm work? Or, or this or that? And I think this is what, what the problem is. Uh, I did not work on the racetrack per se I did not work on the, the runners.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: I did, what we would call it, the nursery, whatever you--the mares, foals and yearlings. And, uh, I have never, uh, thought much about the license program because it--

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: --would, it would involve a lot.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: To me it would be about like a real estate license. You'd have to pay a te-, test. You'd have to have a lot of people involved. And, uh, I, I don't know how it would work. 'Cause then how about the, the fellow that's, that's got a couple of horses of his own and 00:19:00does his own?

SMITH: Right. That's right.

GREATHOUSE: You know? To me, like a shade tree mechanic, he should have a right to work on his own car.

SMITH: Right, no, that makes sense. That makes sense. Okay, so, um, you worked with--well tell me about Mr. Pelster. What was he like?

GREATHOUSE: He, uh, his father was a finish carpenter--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --and, uh, he was, uh, worked, worked with his dad. And he, he hurt his hand real bad and was laid up for a while and decided that he wanted to come down here and go to school. And, uh, he--this--there was a fellow here that had a school. And when he was there a week, the fellow ran out, left him holding the bag with no money and, uh--

SMITH: Oh.

GREATHOUSE: --no job. So he went to work with George Tompkins and, uh, 00:20:00then he worked at one of the theatres as an usher trying to get his apprenticeship finished. Then he worked there for a year or two. And then he was drafted into the service.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: He was very apt. He could, he could watch somebody do something, go to the anvil, and do it.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: I could not. (both laugh) It took me a while longer. I had to think about it and work with it. Sometimes he was just a little impatient on that because he figured, if I can do it, anybody can. But he was, uh, as I say a finish carpenter. He could, he could read, read a foot and see what it needed and apply it.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: He was, he was very good. He was quick. Quick worker. And, uh, it, uh--

SMITH: And what about Tompkins? He seems to be--uh, George Tompkins? Is, saying that right?

GREATHOUSE: Geo-, George?

SMITH: Yeah. Tell me about him. He seems to have helped a lot of--

GREATHOUSE: He helped the ones I named, I think he helped every one of them. Because, uh, he was very free with his time. He would, uh, he would actually come out to the farm and help some of the boys right on the farm and show 'em, uh--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --what to do. And then as I say we'd go to the shop and he'd show us how to make some--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --particular shoes. And, uh, why he was making them that way and why it would work.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: And, um, he um, he trained, he trained, uh, his, his son and, uh, oh, five or six other, maybe more than that, in his lifetime.

SMITH: Is his son still around?

GREATHOUSE: No, his son is deceased. He has one son that's living, but he was not a farrier. He--

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: --uh.

SMITH: Tell me the difference, uh, between being a blacksmith and 00:22:00a farrier.

GREATHOUSE: A farrier is a person who just shoes a horse. A blacksmith is one who makes your ornamental iron, who fix iron wheels and does a lot of welding and things like that.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: So we are, we are called blacksmith, but I think it's a word that doesn't fit us. We're farrier, horseshoer--

SMITH: (laughs) Okay.

GREATHOUSE: --type is what we are.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: 'Cause they're--the blacksmithing is, is, is really different. It's, it's, it's big work.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: Heavy work.

SMITH: Now did you do more of that early on than later in your career? More of making shoes, those kinds of things?

GREATHOUSE: We made most of our shoes from November until about March, because that was the slack time of the year for us. The, uh, the, the 00:23:00yearlings were sent away, either, either sold or sent away to be broke and, uh, raced as two-year-olds. And, uh, there weren't that many farms then either--

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: --as compared to what we have now.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, so we had the time on our hands. And so we made our own, our own shoes. And, uh, uh, kept busy that way. And then, then as the foals started, um, being born we had--of course we, we stayed a lot busier.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And of course through the summer months we stayed real busy with sale horses and things like that.

SMITH: Um-hm. Now you just worked on the farms, is that right?

GREATHOUSE: That's r-, that's correct.

SMITH: Did you ever want to work at the track?

GREATHOUSE: No, I didn't want to travel because, uh, they traveled from--the horses come up from Florida to Kentucky and then to New York 00:24:00and then New York back to Kentucky then down to Florida for the winter. And, uh, I would, would just a rathered stay home with the family. It was--I just didn't care to do that traveling.

SMITH: When did you get married?

GREATHOUSE: In 1950.

SMITH: Okay. Okay.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, I have a, a son and a nephew who are both farriers.

SMITH: Oh.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, they're, they're both still working. And, um, let me go back to, to people that help you the most when you're f-, first starting like Mr. Bell.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, two more men were very helpful to me, and that was Charles and Alfred Nuckols at, uh, Hurstland Farm. Uh--

SMITH: How so?

GREATHOUSE: Uh, I had been working with, uh, Gale for about three years. And, uh, the Hurstland horseshoer, uh, passed away.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: So Gale called down there and asked, uh, if we could have an interview with them and--about, about the work. And his secretary said, "Yes" and she set up a time. She said, "Come at nine o'clock one morning." And we went, both of us went to the office. And, uh, the secretary said, "Well, the--Charles and Alfred are in the breeding shed." So we went back there. This was in February, cold, cold, cold day. And, uh, we looked in the shed and all we could see was a great big hole and two men with their head down in this hole and digging around. Well, the water line had froze up, so Alfred and Charles were 00:26:00in there thawing out that--(laughs)--that line. And I said to myself, these owners doing that, and I told Gale, I said, "We can work for these people," because they were hands-on.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: They, their, their father was--ran the farm for years and they, they, they, they knew about the trade.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, I worked with them the-- the ten years that I was, uh, the remaining ten years that I was with Gale. And, uh, they were very, very helpful. Told me what they wanted when they got, when, when we got to the sale. What they wanted the horse to look like. How they wanted it balanced and things like that. A little different view than you get from the farrier.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: Because, uh, they, they, they knew what it took to sell. And Charles told me, he said, thought it was kind of humorous, he said, "I want this horse to be like a pretty woman. I want when 00:27:00somebody walks by, I want 'em to take a good look at her." (laughs) And it always kind of stuck to my mind. And that's, that's the way you do, you want a horse to be--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --everything that you can be.

SMITH: How would you shoe a horse differently for the sales?

GREATHOUSE: Uh, maybe a horse would have, um, one heel just a little higher than the other.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: But that was the way the horse goes and it was comfortable. And sometimes we would match 'em by taking one heel down a little bit, leaving the other one, keeping them just a little bit under themselves. Things like that that just helps, helps with their, with their looks.

SMITH: Um-hm, um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh--

SMITH: Hmm. So how did you, uh, was you--with Mr., uh, Pelster, how did you find people to work for? Was it word of mouth or--

GREATHOUSE: I was very fortunate. I got to work with a lot of the men 00:28:00that I went to school with.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, being in Midway for four or five years, uh, I, um, got to, uh, work with some people that just got into the business. And, uh, when I left Gale I had a full, full schedule.

SMITH: Now what would that be? What, what would--

GREATHOUSE: Well, uh--

SMITH: --was a full schedule?

GREATHOUSE: --uh, Vin Walden--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --at Midway was just getting started. And he would-- like I did with Mr. Bell, he would come over to the Nuckols Farm and trying to learn some of the things about taking care of the horses. And then- - [telephone rings] then he asked--

SMITH: Do you need to do that? Here.

GREATHOUSE: I, I think my wife will get it. Just-- [telephone rings] I hope so.

SMITH: Want me to pause? [telephone rings] Oh, she got it.

GREATHOUSE: She got it.

SMITH: Okay. Uh--

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, then he asked, uh--we, we talked and he asked me if I would, would do his work. And, uh, worked for him for thirty years.

SMITH: That's a long time.

GREATHOUSE: Worked for Glencrest--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --who was, uh, John Greathouse, my first cousin. Got started and worked for him for about thirty years.

MRS. GREATHOUSE: Glenn?

SMITH: I think the phone's for you. Here, let me--

[Pause in recording.]

SMITH: --keep you busy. Okay, here we go. You--

GREATHOUSE: And then, um, within another year or so, Henry White, uh, horseshoer, was killed in an automobile accident.

SMITH: Oh.

GREATHOUSE: And, um, he called and I worked for him for thirty years. (laughs) And, uh, then of course I worked for King Ranch on two different occasions. I worked the whole ten years I was--did my apprenticeship. And then, uh, Gale called and had more than he could handle and asked if I would--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --talk to Mr. Kitchen (??) who was another, uh, farm manager that helped me a whole lot. And, uh, I went back there and, and worked ten more years and got to meet, uh, Helen Alexander.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: Uh, she would be my first female manager. Very astute and, uh, she, uh, she was real-, really a--and still is a fine horseman. 00:31:00And, uh--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --got along very well.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, um, she would come out when we'd shoe the horses for the sale and, and, uh, just good relationship, good relationship.

SMITH: Now it sounds like you were working with a lot of farms. It sounds like a lot of work.

GREATHOUSE: Yes, uh, I've got, uh, worked for Doug Davis, who--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --and, uh, Saxony Farm, Gainesway Farm, uh, Donamire Farm, I started out with them when they got started. And, uh, then Lochness Farm, Nina Hahn.

SMITH: Okay, I'm not familiar with that one.

GREATHOUSE: She's got a farm in Bourbon County. She was in insurance, horse insurance business.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, I had after I was on my own for about four years, I 00:32:00had about, I had three, three helpers. (Smith laughs) So that's--so it got pretty big.

SMITH: Now was that happening to a lot of people? Were there more farms coming on--

GREATHOUSE: Yes--

SMITH: --at that time?

GREATHOUSE: --you see this is when the boom started in the seventies and eighties when--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --when the, it used to be thirty or forty horses on a farm. And before you know it, there were a hundred and fifty or two hundred.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: And the vastness of some of these farms is just--even when I was growing up there were several big farms. But, uh, nothing like we had, you know, uh--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --have now.

SMITH: Yeah, it, it's amazing to me.

GREATHOUSE: It is. It is amazing how, how it has grown.

SMITH: Has it been hard to--for the blacksmith profession to keep up with the growth? Have you been able to find enough help?

GREATHOUSE: Oh yes, I'd say there's two hundred now.

SMITH: Oh.

GREATHOUSE: There's two hundred in this bluegrass area. Let's put it that way.

SMITH: From fifteen to two hundred.

GREATHOUSE: Um-hm.

SMITH: That's quite a change. Um, tell me then, now you said you worked for ten years with, with Mr. Pelster, was that--did you feel like you had to work that long with him as an apprentice or was that typical?

GREATHOUSE: Not--well, really it was not, because, uh, a lot of the farms that we picked up after I joined him, we went into partnerships with, with those horses after about three years. So then I became kind of a, a partner with some of 'em. But the ones that he--the farms that he--or I had when I started were his farms. And he paid me for doing that. But then we split the, the money on the, the new farms, like, 00:34:00the Henry White and the Dearborn and those that, that I had picked up and, uh, with his help. And we--

SMITH: So--

GREATHOUSE: --worked together. We had to work together because it-- we were getting so busy that we, we needed to, to stay together.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And--

SMITH: So why did you, uh, go off on your own?

GREATHOUSE: Because my nephew was starting and he went with Gale. I did not want to have my nephew as an apprentice. It would, it would work better. So he worked, he w-, worked with Gale. And, then I picked up, uh, my first apprentice was Dorsey Ratliff (??) who, who worked with me for years and years. And then my son, when he graduated from Morehead College, he went with me.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: So.

SMITH: Who were some of the others that you, along the way? You said you 00:35:00had three people with you--

GREATHOUSE: Uh, uh--

SMITH: --for a while.

GREATHOUSE: --and, uh, Dorsey Ratliff's, uh, son, Clifford.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: And then, uh, I helped get some, some boys started. I saw some, some talent in some young men and, uh, I was not able to take on anybody else, because a farm cannot accommodate that many farriers at a time.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, but, um--

SMITH: Can you--could describe a typical day back in, um, well, let's say the fifties, sixties when you were working with Mr. Pelster? What- - you got up in the morning and what'd you do?

GREATHOUSE: Uh, he'd pick me up about seven o'clock in the morning and we'd get out to the farm around 7:30, and, uh, quarter of eight. And, uh, we would probably work on, in a barn, uh--most of the barns at 00:36:00those times were, were tobacco barns that were--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --stalled off, which are good barns. They're, they're airy, and, uh, very, very adequate.

SMITH: I've heard that.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, maybe there'd be, uh, twenty stalls in the, in, in some of those barns. And we'd maybe get a couple of those barns in the morning. And then, uh--

SMITH: So you'd have to do twenty horses?

GREATHOUSE: Yeah.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, we'd do, oh no, we'd do twenty, maybe thirty, thirty in the morning. And, uh, then we'd leave and that would give- -we'd usually leave around 11:30. That would give the, the men time to turn those horses out, get their lunch, get back. Then we'd start around one or 1:15 and work until about 2:30.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: Because that gives--that's a courtesy to the, the people, because that gives them time to get their horses fed and get up so they can get out on time. And we weren't really rushed as much as maybe some of the farriers are today, because they, they, their, their work days are much, much longer than ours--

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: --back, back in the, in the early fifties we just didn't have that much work that we had to--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --work much longer. Gale preferred it that way. He never scheduled work on Saturday. He said that was our day of rest or what we called our make-up day. We'd go back and to put a shoe on that came off or a horse that came in from the track to take the shoe off. But never a scheduled day, Saturday or Sunday. And, um--

SMITH: Makes sense.

GREATHOUSE: And, um, it was--well it gives you--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --time to recoup.

SMITH: So, um, I'm not gonna ask you how much money you made, but could you make a pretty good living as a blacksmith?

GREATHOUSE: Well, we thought we did--(both laugh)--at that time. And, um, uh, we started out it was, uh, it was two dollars. We got two dollars a head for trimming.

SMITH: Oh my.

GREATHOUSE: And then, then it went up to three. Then five, then eight, ten, twelve, fifteen and the, the--

SMITH: Is that just for trimming the hoof?

GREATHOUSE: Yeah, just for trimming, yes.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: The, the shoeing was, was different. We, we shod for the sale. We, we mostly, 90 percent of our work I guess was, was trimming, 'cause we trimmed the broodmares and the babies and the yearlings until it was time for sale. And back then, in the fif-, in the fifties, a lot of the horses we sent to the sale, we sent a lot of the fillies 00:39:00barefoot.

SMITH: Really?

GREATHOUSE: As Henry White would say, "What you see is what you get." (laughs) Just, just trim 'em and we shod the colts, 'cause they'd get a little bit more active, do a little more pawing and things. And but--and then, uh, later on in, in the sixties we, we started shoeing everything that went to the sale.

SMITH: Okay. So, um, a horse--I don't come from a horse background, so I apologize if I ask questions that seem a little ignorant, because they are. Um, does a horse need, a horse that's just on the farm, basically, most, uh, a broodmare, do they need shoed that often?

GREATHOUSE: No.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: Unless you've got a deformity or a horse that has maybe injured a ankle or something like that and, uh, is not very mobile. And that you put a shoe on there just to protect it.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, but most of our--90 percent of the broodmares were barefoot.

SMITH: Hmm, okay. But the colts were a little different?

GREATHOUSE: Yeah. Well, this kept their feet from cracking up and looking too bad when you go to the sale. You want to put your best food forward when you go to Keeneland.

SMITH: Now what are--were some of the problems you would have encountered with, um, a horse's foot, say, in the fifties and the sixties? What, what were you learning to, to-- if there was a problem, like you say, a deformity, or--

GREATHOUSE: Well, their, their, their physical make-up, um, typically you, you want a horse that, as we say, he'll walk right--well, straight to you, who will break right, right on over. But so many of 'em will be narrow-chested and they would be forced to, to turn out, a bit--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --when they walk. Or some of 'em would be wide in the chest, they would have a tendency to be pigeon-toed. And you try to co-, not so much we use the word correction, but to try to get 'em back 00:41:00in balance and keep 'em from getting any worse.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, that was our biggest job with the babies. And, uh, as I call 'em, the foals, to, uh, to keep them as, as nice as you can and as balanced as you can.

SMITH: Um-hm. Now, you-- although you didn't really work with race horses, um, or did you work with them when they came back for breeding, did you work with stallions?

GREATHOUSE: Well, yes, they, the-- we called 'em the main mares that came off the track that hadn't, hadn't been bred yet. And, uh, sometimes we'd have to keep the plates on them a little while just to get acclimated because they'd been shod, maybe, for a couple of years--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --on the track, and, uh, get the wall a little stronger. And then we'd take the shoes off and--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --and, uh--

SMITH: Um-hm. But did you ever work with stallions?

GREATHOUSE: Yes. Uh, that's another thing I think has changed a lot. 00:42:00Most all the farms I worked on then had a stallion or two on 'em.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: But, uh, not anymore. Now it's-- so many of the smaller farms just cannot keep--

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: --the stallions.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: Uh--

SMITH: Or was there a different bre-, uh, challenge with shoeing a stallion or being a farrier for a stallion over a mare?

GREATHOUSE: No, no. They just, just they were heavier and you had to watch 'em a little bit, being a stallion.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: Good grooms could handle 'em. Most, most of 'em were-- weren't, weren't any trouble to work on.

SMITH: Who were some of the horses that you worked on that I might recognize?

GREATHOUSE: Uh, well, um, the, the Gainesway stallions were, uh-- wish I 00:43:00didn't have senior moments that I can't remember a lot of their names, but--

SMITH: (laughs) That's okay.

GREATHOUSE: --uh, they were, they were good stallions.

SMITH: Now what--you worked for them for how long?

GREATHOUSE: I worked for them as long as I apprenticed for, for Gale.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: And then when I left Gale he, he, he kept, uh, Gainesway Farm. And Joe Taylor was another one that was very instrumental in helping me too, because we first met Mr. Taylor when Gainesway subdivision was a farm.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: Way back--that was around, it was in '55. And then, uh, they had, so of course they had sold that.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And they were in transition and they bought a couple three farms. And then of course they ended up where they are now, buying part of C.V. Whitney's farm, that, uh--

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: --is now Gainesway. And, uh, they, uh--

SMITH: Now they always had pretty good horses. They always had pretty 00:44:00good horses, didn't they?

GREATHOUSE: Oh yes, they do. Yes they do. They have wonderful horses.

SMITH: Now did you ever work at Calumet?

GREATHOUSE: I, uh, worked there a couple of months with a farrier that, uh, he and his helper were in an automobile accident. And the helper broke his arm and he separated his shoulder. And, uh, I worked there for a couple of months until they got back on their feet. But I did not work, quote, just, uh, helped out--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --at, uh, um--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --we, we did that a lot. They, they'd help, if somebody got down we usually-- the farriers would come in and do the work for 'em.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: Send a check to 'em. And it was--

SMITH: Now this is pretty physically demanding work, isn't it?

GREATHOUSE: That's correct.

SMITH: But, um, can you describe that, I mean what it--I know--

GREATHOUSE: Well--(laughs)--I've had two back surgeries.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: And, um, I had my nose broken. And, um, but, uh, it's--you either do it or you don't. I mean, you--if you go, if you, if you're afraid, uh, don't do it.

SMITH: Now I, I seem to recall something that Jackie Thompson said about it, it was hard if you were a tall person, to do the blacksmithing from-- 'cause of bending over all the time.

GREATHOUSE: Right.

SMITH: You're not very short yourself. (Greathouse laughs) So.

GREATHOUSE: Uh, maybe, uh, one thing I had going for me is I've never been too heavy.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: That was a help. And, uh, you, uh, it was something though I had to do most every day. If I went on vacation for a couple weeks 00:46:00I'd come back and be awful stiff and sore for several days getting back in shape.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: Some young men could go off on vacation, come right back and do a full, full week's work right away. But it took me just a little while to, to get back in shape.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: So I would rather work a little every day and keep in shape than to--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --skip around.

SMITH: So in those early years you were doing, maybe thirty horses a day? Thirty, forty horses a day?

GREATHOUSE: Uh, earlier in life. But, uh, later on, I'd say after I turned fifty, uh, twenty-five would be, would, would top me up. And that would be with a few horses to shoe in that bunch. But I'd try not to do anymore than that.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: I just, I could--

SMITH: --so--

GREATHOUSE: --I could keep my schedule that way.

SMITH: --so it was--

GREATHOUSE: 'Cause you see with four people getting twenty-five head, 00:47:00that's a hundred head of horses a day--

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: --when you think about it. I mean you could, you can move around a farm pretty quick.

SMITH: Hmm. So would, uh, would each day be a different farm? Is that-- would each day you'd go to a different farm? Is that how it worked?

GREATHOUSE: Uh, sometimes, uh, some farms would want us--just use us in the morning.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, then we would get what we called some of the smaller farms in the afternoon. You just kind of have to schedule it out. Uh, it, uh, and then some farms would say, "Come on, you're gonna mess us up all day anyhow--(laughs)--so come on and do the work and --(Smith laughs)--and, and go." So.

SMITH: Now did you ever work for, um, I've read where a lot of, of farms have their own farriers now, that that's, that they just work for, for one farm. Is that-- was that something that you saw?

GREATHOUSE: A, a farrier work for one farm?

SMITH: Right.

GREATHOUSE: Um, Mr. Carl worked for a, um, Claiborne Farm. And that was the-- but he had a couple other farms, but that was his big farm. Claiborne was so big at that time, for one man, it was practically--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --all you could do. I, personally, did not like to do that because if you did have a misunderstanding or something, you were out of a whole lot of work. I would have rather worked for ten or twelve farms, and, uh, worked that way.

SMITH: Um-hm. It makes sense. It makes sense.

GREATHOUSE: Because, uh, you know, managers change. And, um, uh, but, as I say, I was real fortunate to work for so many, quote, friends, that I stayed on a--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --long time with a lot a, a lot of good people.

SMITH: Um-hm. Um-hm. Now did you, um, Ed Fallon was telling me that, um, for many years, uh, a long time ago, the blacksmiths often were the ones that took care of the health of a horse. Uh, now did you work closely with vets if there were any issues with--

GREATHOUSE: Oh yes.

SMITH: --the horses?

GREATHOUSE: Yes, I think when there's any doubt you need to get a veterinarian.

SMITH: What were some of the things that would make you think, okay, I need someone to look at this horse's foot.

GREATHOUSE: Sometimes we would have a horse that would come up with what we called a, a gravel. It would maybe get a piece of gravel or an abscess. And if I was having trouble to get the--to find the abscess or if it was a deep abscess I would have 'em call the veterinarian 00:50:00out. And, uh, we'd kind of work on it together. It just kind of--with insurance on these horses like it is now and everything, if you have an attending vet it just is so much easier--

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: --to, uh, to do that.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: Uh, and fortunately we have some of the top veterinarians in the, in the country, bar none.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, it, uh--and it's nice to have that as a crutch. It is really nice to get on the phone and call the vet and say, "We need you."

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: And they're very cour-, most all of 'em were very courteous about it.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, they're--now, and they specialize so much now you've got so many young veterinarians that have had, uh, have had, uh, 00:51:00shod horses before and, uh, kind of can re-, relate to the farrier.

SMITH: Oh. That helps.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, and that is good.

SMITH: Um-hm. Now when you started in the fifties, we didn't have as many vets around here. Um, how has some of that changed when--in the thirty plus years that you worked as a, a farrier? What are some of the changes that you've seen in, in terms of the care of the horse's foot, um--

GREATHOUSE: The, uh, well, the number--I, I wished I could tell you if the farriers--that, well, we had--Hagyard-Davidson-McGee, I guess were the, were the big firm, at that time. And, uh, it's, it's, it's hard to 00:52:00answer that, because the percentages that the, the, the, the, the farms were comparatively small compared to what they are now. And, uh--

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: --I just, uh, they, and the reproduction is, is done so much different than it was--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --in '55--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --when I started. 'Cause now they, they can, they can tell these mares, when they're gonna ovulate and, and, you know, in a, just a few hours.

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: Where we were--

SMITH: That's amazing.

GREATHOUSE: --we were just, they were just guessing. I think the, the average was two and a half covers a--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --a mare back in '55, in the fifties, and probably way less than that now.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: Because the technique and their--the way of doing it is so much, so much better and precise.

SMITH: But in terms of taking care of a, a horse's foot, did that change 00:53:00much or is it still pretty basically the same?

GREATHOUSE: Yeah, because it's, as Ed said, uh, we, we did most of it.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: We, we took care of most of the, the problems. Um--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --and then they, uh, they, they could, they could do for-, hoof surgery now that they, they couldn't do then.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: They could, uh, uh, take bone chips out and things like that, that--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --we, we couldn't handle. X-rays. They can find things now too--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --that our X-rays were very poor back in the fifties, compared to the X-rays they take now.

SMITH: Now did you notice, um, Jackie said in his interviews, as things come back to me, that he thought we were breeding the foot off the horse. Have you noticed a change in, in horses that way?

GREATHOUSE: I agree with that too. But we've also the, the whole frame. We don't have the bone on the horses that we have now. We've, we've, we've, we find them to speed--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --and, uh, speed kills.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, some of the, the bull lay (??) horses, those types, the big boned, strong boned horses, that could race thirty, forty times. You don't--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --you don't see that much anymore.

SMITH: Hmm. But--and you've seen a difference in the foot as well though?

GREATHOUSE: Yes.

SMITH: In what way is it--

GREATHOUSE: Uh, the, uh, the hoof wall, the horn, is, is, is not as, uh, dense. And, uh, we have sometimes some of these speed horses do not breed good-footed horses.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: But they can run for a while.

SMITH: What kind of challenge does that pose to the blacksmith to, to 00:55:00try to, um, correct a horse with, using the shoe to help a horse with maybe a bad foot? 'Cause everyone's heard about the quarter crack with a, Big Brown. Is there anything that blacksmiths can do to help a horse with a bad foot?

GREATHOUSE: Well, they've got so many, uh, patches and things that they can put on to help that we did not have any kind of the--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --acrylics and things like that to, uh, to patch with. Uh, maybe shouldn't say it, but the Big Browns would--the veterinarian would probably cut the quarter crack out--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --per se, and give the horse some rest and let it grow out.

SMITH: Oh, okay. So approach--

GREATHOUSE: But if you, but if you've got a Derby horse and you can patch it, I would do-- if it was my horse, I would patch it too.

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: Uh.

SMITH: Um, let's, uh, go back to--somebody told me that you used to work on Hamburg? At Hamburg? Did you work for the, at the Maddens?

GREATHOUSE: The Meadowcrest Farm was of Hamburg Farm.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, if, the--there were two brothers, Joe and Ed. And, and, uh, I worked on the Joe Madden part of the farm. And, as I understand, they got in some kind of disagreement and they said--and Joe said, "You build a chain-link fence around this hundred acres and you can have the rest." (laughs)

SMITH: Oh.

GREATHOUSE: This, this was in, uh, in, uh, the twenties or thirties.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, Joe died in New York while the mansion was being built.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: And then, uh, uh, Mr. Madden married, uh, this, uh, Mr. 00:57:00Maxwell and that's who I was employed by. But then--

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: --she had a son, Johnny Madden that was a little younger than I was. And when he got out of, uh, school, then he kind of took over the managing of the horses.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, but they never got too big. They just had--of course on a hundred acres you don't get too many horses on it.

SMITH: No.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, but that was, uh, that was my--

SMITH: So that was in your early--

GREATHOUSE: That was, that was early, early fifties.

SMITH: And that's when you weren't being a, weren't a blacksmith?

GREATHOUSE: That's right.

SMITH: (laughs) Okay.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, it, uh, it's just funny how things work out.

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: So I started in 1955 and retired in 1975.

SMITH: Nineteen seventy-five.

GREATHOUSE: Um-hm.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: Now I wasn't working full-time at that time.

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: --But, uh, uh--

SMITH: Is that pretty typical to, um, for a, for a blacksmith to work, what is thirty years basically?

GREATHOUSE: A lot of 'em hang--

SMITH: --twenty ----------(??) years--

GREATHOUSE: --around.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: They love it. Jackie Thompson, I don't think he was ill maybe three or four months, and he shod right up until, until he couldn't anymore. Didn't do many, but he just loved to be out. He said he, he couldn't stay home. He loved to get out to the racetrack and talk with the, with the grooms and with other horseshoers, and very helpful to other horseshoers. The horseshoers kind of flock around him when they needed some help, they, they'd go to him.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: A little different on the track. The horses with, would forge--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --they actually reach up and hit themselves and things like 00:59:00that. And he was expert at preventing that.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, he loved his trade. Loved it.

SMITH: Who were some of the other, um, farriers or blacksmiths that you'd admired?

GREATHOUSE: At, at my age or now? (laughs)

SMITH: Both.

GREATHOUSE: Okay. That's, that's a difficult question because in 1991 I semi retired and went to work for Mr. Clinkinbeard at Breeder's Supply and set up a farrier supply business.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: And I got to meet practically all the farriers in this area.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: And the competition in this area is so great, you better be good.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: They're all very capable.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: They're, they, and, uh, it's, um, yeah, then I, uh, you've 01:00:00got the, uh, the, the saddle horseshoers and things that I have never done, but I love to watch them work just to see how, you know, they build up the foot with all the pads and everything, and it's, uh, it's just a talent. How, how all horses, they're, they're horses to start with, but how so many of 'em, so many talents.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: Trot, pace, gaited, runners.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, it take--and each, so many, uh, farriers are, take different directions on what they, what they want to do.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: I've talked to farriers that have never trimmed a, a foal.

SMITH: Really?

GREATHOUSE: Yeah. They always, they've worked on mature horses all their life, hunters and jumpers.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, so it is, it is, even though you don't think it is, diversified.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: Then I've talked to a lot of horseshoers that said they would never, they'd never fool with a runner because they're crazy. (both laugh) I said, "Well, they have to be, not crazy, but they, they're hyped up."

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: They're ready to run.

SMITH: They have to have some spirit there.

GREATHOUSE: That's, that's right. They got a good spirit.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh--

SMITH: Well, what about when you started? Um, you obviously thought a lot of Mr. Pelster and, uh, George Thomplin, if I'm saying his name right.

GREATHOUSE: And Jack.

SMITH: Tompkins. Tompkins. That's what I'm saying wrong.

GREATHOUSE: Um-hm. And, um, well, I think any of us, when we start out in any business, you always, uh, remember the ones that kind of helped you the most.

SMITH: Sure.

GREATHOUSE: But on and on some of the, some of the veterinarians have, have been a tremendous help. Ed Fallon.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: Dr. Rick Reddin. Uh, those fellows that have worked, 01:02:00especially, uh, Rick Reddin's worked just with, mostly with the feet.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, uh, very, very, very helpful. But, uh, you, um, think about some of the--was thinking about when you were gonna do this visit today, I was thinking about King Ranch and that little area up there, Darby Dan, King Ranch and Calumet Farm. You know, if you--as the crow flies, they're all within three miles of each other.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: Of course Calumet had five Derby winners. Mr. Bradley had four. Darby Dan had two, which was part of--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --Bradley's. And, uh, that little crescent right through 01:03:00there that raised so many Derby winners. And I was thinking, why?

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And I-- this is my conclusion, it was the water.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: You've got the spring down here, McConnell Spring where it started. And you got an artesian well there that the water, running this high, that runs right down through that Frankfort area. And at King Ranch they had these big concrete water pools and water ran out of 'em constantly.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: Day and night and all through there. And now we've, we've lost it through pollution.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: And you just, you just wonder if this is what put the bone on 'em. We just talked about bone on horses and things like that, with 01:04:00the limestone.

SMITH: Um-hm, that's what I've heard.

GREATHOUSE: It's, it's, uh, it just makes you wonder. You, you don't, I guess there's never any way of proving it. But, uh, uh--

SMITH: Well, Kentucky always had a reputation as being a great place to raise horses.

GREATHOUSE: That's right. And even when the distillery was out here, Pepper Distillery--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --the water was so, so pure that they tried to buy the rights to it and, uh, the farmer that owned it wouldn't let 'em use, use the water. So, so--

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: --it's, uh, is it--we just, just a, it was just a, a thought, but, it--because I thought maybe you'd probably ask a question about the, the bone and everything. That, that it-- would, would it be that simple? Maybe not. (laughs)

SMITH: Well, it certainly seems to be a big question right now--

GREATHOUSE: Um-hm.

SMITH: --that the industry's challenged by.

GREATHOUSE: Right.

SMITH: And, uh, and I get different answers, you know--

GREATHOUSE: That's right.

SMITH: --from people as to whether they think there really has been a change. Um, whether it's breeding, whether it's, you know, just changes in the environment or--

GREATHOUSE: Right.

SMITH: --uh, but most people do some to agree that, that something's different. That they're not quite as sturdy as they used to be.

GREATHOUSE: No, it's true.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, I think this is where the public is losing the interest too, because by the time they follow a horse and get excited, the horse is retired.

SMITH: Um-hm, um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh--

SMITH: Or hurt.

GREATHOUSE: Or hurt, right. And, uh, every sport needs a, needs a Tiger Woods.

SMITH: This is kind of current, but, um, the whole issue about toe grabs, did you have much experience with those shoes?

GREATHOUSE: The--yes, through, through the shop, yes. But, uh, the horseshoers have cut down on these toe grabs for the last five or six years. And, uh, there was a theory that the more toe grab you had on the more the horse would reach out and pull under himself and, and, uh, they've just proved that that, that, that that doesn't work. And now with the, with the new turf out there, it's, it's made a lot of difference.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: So I see where Keeneland is not going to allow any toes on the front anyhow. I don't know about the rear--

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: --yet. But, uh--

SMITH: What do you think about the new track surfaces, polytrack?

GREATHOUSE: I think we need another year or two.

SMITH: Oh.

GREATHOUSE: I understand that there's not as many breakdowns. But I don't know how many sore horses there are--

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: --coming off the track.

SMITH: Um-hm, um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, anything that we can do to, uh, eliminate some of those injuries--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --but, again.

SMITH: Well, I'm gonna take you back, uh, to your time when you were actively working as, as a blacksmith. Now you said you, you retired in '75? Is it '75 or '85?

GREATHOUSE: Seventy-five.

SMITH: '75. And uh--

GREATHOUSE: I retired at age seventy-five. It was in the nineties that I quit.

SMITH: Oh okay.

GREATHOUSE: I worked, I worked from--

SMITH: You were seventy-five. All right.

GREATHOUSE: --from twenty-five years old till seventy-five years old. So that's a fifty year span.

SMITH: Now when you retired, about how many horses, at seventy-five, how many horses were you taking care of?

GREATHOUSE: I had two farms. I had the Buckamolk (??) out here. I had about, uh, seventy-five or eighty horses. And the other farm had about fifty. That was for the whole month. (laughs) I would work tw-, a 01:08:00couple, couple three hours a day at the most. Just enough to keep busy and, and maybe, and not every day.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: But I just, uh, uh, Buckamolk was a situation where, uh, they, uh, liked to start a little late in the morning and--

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: --quit about 2:30. And so many of the farriers that were, were jammed up that they had to get to work by eight o'clock and work a little later. And I fit in their program very well because I would--I was free, so I could--if there was, if I didn't get to work till nine and work from nine till 11:30 in the morning, that was enough.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: It worked out very well. I worked for them until the farm was sold to, uh, Mr. Jackson.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: And then I retired completely.

SMITH: Fifty years. That's a long time to do something that's physically demanding. Um, I'm, I'm sure there's economic reasons why you continued. But why did you, did you do it for so long?

GREATHOUSE: 'Cause I wanted to. I, I really did. 'Cause I wanted to. I could, uh, you know, I could work at the farrier shop. But I just liked to be out. I just liked to be out and about. They were well, well broke horses and, uh, it was just, it was easy for me.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: I mean I didn't, I didn't get tired because I, I wasn't working that long. And--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --just, just enjoyed it. Just enjoyed going out there and watching 'em grow and watch 'em change and, and--

SMITH: Do you ever wish you'd done anything different?

GREATHOUSE: Oh, you think about, uh, maybe going into management. But 01:10:00after seeing what these poor managers have to go through, I don't believe I would have made a very good farm manager. They have a, a lot of responsibility. They've got to keep up with the farrier, with the veterinarian, with their clientele. And, uh, uh, it's just, uh, just, th-, they stay so busy.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, and, and another thing too, some of my farms, like, King Ranch, did not have borders, per se. They--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --they all belonged to the family.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And by doing that, you're talking about, uh, your confirmation and everything, when you work on the same mares year after year after year, you almost know what kind of foals they're gonna have.

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: And that is a big help to the horseshoer, because he says, 01:11:00"Oh no, this horse is gonna be this way or that way because this is what the mama does." And that--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --makes it better than when you work for a boarding farm when you only work on the horse, maybe three months--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --during the breeding season then they're shipped out. You, you, you don't keep up with them. And, uh, so it, it makes it a little bit easier when you work on the horses that you've worked on--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --year after year after year.

SMITH: Um-hm. Now, um, in the--when you first started, were you, when you had a shoe a horse, did you make your own horseshoes? And did that change? Or were there already pre-made horseshoes that you could, I think what, what, is it aluminum?

GREATHOUSE: The, uh--we did not use aluminum on the farm. At that time, the aluminum was, was very soft.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: Now you have aluminum with a little titanium in it and this, 01:12:00and it's a little fir-, firmer, and you can, you can use it. But the, the aluminum, what we would call the shoe, would spring out it, on, it--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --on the farm. And, uh, so we used, we used steel, toe steel plates when we-, when we shod 'em. But now the manufactures have gotten so that they're can really make good, good shoes.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: And I'd say now that there's very few--(cough)--of 'em that are forged, other than special shoes.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: The bar shoes, things like that.

SMITH: So you don't have to learn how to do that to be a blacksmith?

GREATHOUSE: Have to? It should be required--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --let's put it that way. You should be able to work, work 01:13:00the forge.

SMITH: Did you enjoy that, working the forge?

GREATHOUSE: Not as much as somebody like Jackie would.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: Uh, he was a perfectionist. And if he'd see somebody make a shoe that he didn't know how, he'd go right to the shop and try to make one just like it, or better.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: He was just that way. He was--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --he was quite exceptional. And to be honest with you, uh, the time is the essence for these farriers now that they, they have so much to do and a short length of time. When you've got five thousand five hundred yearlings gonna be sold in the next three weeks--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --that's a lot of shoes to put on.

SMITH: Hmm. Tell me about the sales. Were you, um--it seems like that was always a pretty busy time for you--

GREATHOUSE: Oh yes--

SMITH: --to get the horses ready.

GREATHOUSE: --oh yes.

SMITH: Did you go to the sales?

GREATHOUSE: Uh, not much, because you were too busy at--getting 'em prepared to go to the sales.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: Now I'd go in the evenings sometimes and, and catch, catch the, catch it for an hour or so.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, but as far as--of course later, like now, I enjoy going. I go out at my own leisure and go out at the sales, and of course visit with, with some of the, the, the farms and things.

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: It's fun.

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: But, uh, you try not to get involved too much, because this is their business out there. And they're busy. They haven't got time to talk. Just, you know, I leave the management alone. Just wave at 'em and--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --and, uh, then after the show day is over, then you can have time to visit, or early in the morning. But, uh--

SMITH: Did you ever work with any of the yearlings that you thought were particularly exceptional? Do you remember any horses that, that sold well?

GREATHOUSE: (pause) Candidate. He was raised at Gainesway Farm.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, they had a Standardbred colt out there too. And they were both so rough that they put 'em together, 'cause it--they were just shoeing the other colts up. They were just bad play fellows. And, uh, Joe Taylor said, "Let's just put them back in here in this paddock back here by themselves and let 'em--(laughs)--let 'em fight it out." And both of 'em turned out to be champions. (laughs) So that's why you remember 'em, they, they just had that, that drive.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And then my favorite of all horses was a filly that was raised at King Ranch, belonged to Helen Alexander. She was a big, long, lanky filly. Wasn't too attractive. But boy, she had a attitude of her own. And, uh, she was my, uh, a first. This was the stallion's first crop. I'll tell you later who it was.

SMITH: (laughs) That's okay.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, she was about the same way. She couldn't get along with the other fillies, so they put her back, right be, oh, a couple months before she was due to be sold. And put her back with another 01:17:00filly in a brand new barn. And at that time they would take this traffic bound gravel--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --and pad all the stalls down with it. And, uh, so they put her in there for the first time. And they called me and said, "Glenn, you need to come out and put shoes on the filly." I said, "Okay." Well I went in there and she had dug a hole, foot and a half deep, in there that night and wore her toe down a little bit. So I put a shoe on her- - put some shoes on her. And a couple--oh, eight, ten days later, the farm manager called and said, "This filly's is off on one foot." So I took the shoe off and I either got a close nail, or when she was pawing 01:18:00in that gravel she got a piece of gravel up--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --in white line. And she wasn't, wasn't sore. She was just off a little bit. But it ended up they had to take her out of the Fasig-Tipton sale. And the day--and of course I was just in bad shape. You know, I just, man, oh man, what have I done? The day that she was scheduled to sell she broke a little bitty puss bucket way back by the bobbled hill and she was fine. So Helen sent her to D. Wayne Lukas to break. She was by Alydar, first crop. Turned out to be Althea.

SMITH: Oh, okay.

GREATHOUSE: She won beaucoups of races. Turned out to be the best thing that ever--(laughs)--happened to us, because she got to keep her and she sold--

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: --millions of dollars worth of horses out of that family.

SMITH: Huh.

GREATHOUSE: So it was a bad break that turned good.

SMITH: That's right.

GREATHOUSE: But she'll never forget it, 'cause I was just worried sick about that filly not making the sales.

SMITH: That's right.

GREATHOUSE: So sometimes good happens out of--(Smith laughs)--out of mistakes. But she was a top filly. But she came back, another interesting story, came back. She had hurt her ankle. Was bred, pronounced in foal. And her mother, Courtly Dee, was pronounced in foal. So they decided, well, they put all the mares that are gonna, gonna foal in one field, and the barren mares over in the other. Well it was the awfulest ruckus you ever heard out there. Two mares were fighting. Well, it was momma and daughter. (laughs) It was Courtly Dee and Althea. So they--(laughs)--had to separate the two. 01:20:00[telephone rings] And, and the sad part was about it she had several foals. [telephone rings] But she still just ran out with, with one other mare.

SMITH: Oh.

GREATHOUSE: Turned, always turned the other mare out first.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: Turned Althea out. She ran down through the field and ran right over the top of the mare and broke her neck.

SMITH: Althea's neck?

GREATHOUSE: Um-hm.

SMITH: Aw.

GREATHOUSE: Broke your heart.

SMITH: Aw. How old was she when that happened?

GREATHOUSE: I don't know. I wasn't working there then. I had retired then from, from there. But, uh--

SMITH: Aw.

GREATHOUSE: --I don't know. But she was just, she just was so hyper that she just had to run. She just had to compete every day.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: And you just never forget that.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh--

SMITH: When you had a horse that spirited, clearly you liked 'em, but were they hard to work with?

GREATHOUSE: Oh yes. Yeah. She and her mother both, they had, just had 01:21:00an attitude.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: The mother, Courtly Dee, sometimes I could trim her. And the other times, if she was in a bad humor, I could tell, I'd just skip her. I'd say, "I'll be back tomorrow." Come back tomorrow and, and trim her.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: That's why I say I liked about working with horses you have worked with year after year after year. You get to know their dispositions.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: Some of 'em just get an attitude on a given day and, uh, she was a very protective mother.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: She, she took care of those babies.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: It just funny how you remember 'em that way. But, uh--

SMITH: Were there other horses that were a particular challenge that you can remember?

GREATHOUSE: No, I can't, I can't say that, uh--of course sometimes you don't, you work on 'em and then they're gone for--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --eighteen months before they start running. And then you say, well, you know, you worked on this horse a year and a half ago. And then you try to remember all the ones you've worked on. You try to pick 'em out. Unless there's something outstanding about 'em, like that attitude--(laughs)--uh, you don't, uh, you don't, uh, really--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --remember 'em. 'Cause when you work on hundreds of 'em, they do run together.

SMITH: (laughs) Yeah, I would think so, over your career. But as you were working as a blacksmith, uh, I mean you had to go out whenever. The weather didn't matter. You basically had to go when you needed to go, right?

GREATHOUSE: When it got below twenty, we didn't go out.

SMITH: (laughs) Below twenty. Okay.

GREATHOUSE: Yeah.

SMITH: Was it just hard to, to do it then, or--

GREATHOUSE: Yeah, it, it was. And it's, uh, you just, you're, you're just so cold. It's, it's, it, and we didn't have that, you know, we 01:23:00don't have that much cold weather in Kentucky--

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: --that you, that you can't work, that you can't give up a few days work. Sometimes it's too hot to work--(laughs)--too, but you do it. I mean, when it gets--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --July and August weather sometimes can get awful hot for these fellows. But they, they get the fans and things out. But there's not much you can do with cold.

SMITH: No.

GREATHOUSE: Because, uh, the management frowns on you putting little salamander heats and things in those barns. It's a little scary.

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: And I don't blame 'em. I never, I never did use one. If it was too cold, it was just too cold.

SMITH: Hmm. Hmm. Hmm. Well you--okay, you said you retired com-, completely when you were seventy-five. But you've mentioned working in a, um, a business. What is that?

GREATHOUSE: That was Breeder's Supply. That was a farrier supply 01:24:00business.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: I started that in, uh, 1991.

SMITH: You started the business?

GREATHOUSE: Well, it was, uh, they just sold a few items. But now it's a complete, it's a complete shop--

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: --where we sell all kinds of shoes, uh, aluminum, steel, gaited, and, uh, it's just like a big hardware store. (laughs)

SMITH: So do you still work with that?

GREATHOUSE: I go in on Wednesdays. Now I started a couple months ago going on Wednesdays for, for four hours just to talk with some of the fellows and, and, uh, and go around to, uh, like when the junior league was on I'd go over and visit with some of the farriers and re-, renew acquaintances and--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --just, I enjoy it. Just handshake or you get to see some of the young fellows again.

SMITH: Are you still, um, up--do you own part of the business or--

GREATHOUSE: No.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: No. Do not. And, uh, that was a way to let me, uh, retire and still stay in the game, I guess you might say. I still keep up with the--with what's going on at the farms, and, and, uh--

SMITH: Do you miss the work?

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, get on the telephone and help some of the fellows that, uh, need, need a special shoe or something. I give 'em suggestion on what we've got that might work, things like that.

SMITH: Um-hm. Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, it's, it's kind of unique. You, you don't have many farrier supply businesses.

SMITH: No. No.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh--

SMITH: So when did your son get involved in the business?

GREATHOUSE: When?

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: He, he worked, uh, through the college years he worked for me every summer. And then when he, then when he, uh, graduated from 01:26:00college, then he went to work with me full-time.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh--

SMITH: Is he still working?

GREATHOUSE: Um-hm. He and my nephew work together. (laughs)

SMITH: Okay. (both laugh)

GREATHOUSE: So, uh--

SMITH: Does he just work with the Thoroughbreds, or--

GREATHOUSE: Yeah, they both, both, both work with Thoroughbreds.

SMITH: Hmm. Hmm. Now you've worked with a lot of farms and a lot of different, different horsemen. Who were some of the horsemen that you admired?

GREATHOUSE: Uh, see--as I said, before, you always admire the ones that help you the most when you were the youngest. Mr. Francis McKinsey who was the manager of Walnut Hall Stud.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: If, if you've ever been out there to see that great big, uh, barn that's out there, that big, long, long barn--

SMITH: I'm not sure.

GREATHOUSE: Okay. It's--(laughs)--a mile long. You fill that thing up full of yearlings and we'd, we'd, we'd shoe 'em all. And then they'd pony and they'd lead 'em, to teach 'em to trot so they could show 'em. And, uh, he was, he knew what he wanted.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: He was strict but fair, and, and kind. And, uh, he helped me a lot in my-- hmm, I guess my third year that I was third year apprenticeship. And, uh, he--

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: -- he was tremendous help. Harold Kitchen at King Ranch was, uh, very good. And then Mr. Howard Ralphs (??), who was the general manager that, uh, he lived in Midway and I knew him when I was growing up, uh, uh, in Midway.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, of course as I said, the Nuckols-- Nuckols brothers, and my cousin John Greathouse--

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: --to-, took me, uh, when I was quite young in, in the business, and, uh, I had a good relationship there. And, uh, it, uh-- and of course the best friend, would I don't want to brag on him too much 'cause he'd get a big head is Henry White.

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: Henry was a--but, uh, it was, uh, if you say to yourself now, I'm gonna go to work for Henry, you know, Hen-, Henry will be calling me. But he was true to the smith that he had, the blacksmith that he had. And as long as he was working there and able to do it, he was gonna stay. And I admire him for it.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And then when the accident happened, he called and we have a wonderful relationship.

SMITH: Now have I heard he could be a bit of a prankster sometimes?

GREATHOUSE: Oh terrible. And, uh, he, he, uh, well Ed Fallon was just about as bad. (Smith laughs) And, uh, they--he, uh, he put, Ed put Limburger cheese on the muffler, um, on the ex-, uh, exhaust pipe of my car. (Smith laughs) And about three or four miles down the road, it began to get bad. (Smith laughs) And he knew nothing about it, you know. Ed would know nothing about it. But those were the kind of pranks that they would pull and-- they--it was, it was something else.

SMITH: I interviewed, um, Butch Murrell. He worked--he's a, a black man who worked for, um, E.V. Benjamin. And he and Dr. Fallon worked 01:30:00together a lot. And, uh, they pulled pranks on each other it seems on a regular basis. So I, I have heard a few of those stories. So--

GREATHOUSE: And then somebody put Vaseline all over his, his steering wheel when he, when he went to leave the farm. (Smith laughs) We got, we got even with him. And, uh, but, uh--

SMITH: Hmm. Yes, I've, I enjoyed interviewing both of those, those gentlemen. But, um, well, also when you worked at the farms, did you work with a lot of trainers? Did you--were you involved with any of the trainers?

GREATHOUSE: I met a lot of trainers. But I didn't work with, with them. I think, uh, well they would come in and look at the, look at the horses for their, their clients and tell 'em which ones they want to put in training.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, where they wanted to send 'em. Like King Ranch at 01:31:00that time, they had three trainers. They had one in California, one in New York and one in New Orleans. Then they had the pecking order. The New York fellow got what he wanted and then the California and then the fellow in Louisiana got the rest of 'em.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, that was the way it would work. And they would, uh, they, they would come up and look at the, look at the yearlings. And--(coughs)--another thing too that might be of interest, when they got ready to break the yearlings at King Ranch, they would put 'em in box cars right behind the, the railroad track ran right behind King Ranch. They'd--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --put 'em in box cars and ship them to, uh, Texas--

SMITH: Hmm, to do it there--

GREATHOUSE: --uh, during the war and into the fifties.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, I mean you'd put a horse in a box car now you'd, uh, you'd--(laughs)--they'd--(laughs)--have a fit.

SMITH: I would think so.

GREATHOUSE: They fly 'em now. But it was, it was quite common. And then we, when I was working for Meadowcrest Farm, um, Mr. Bell was gonna sell a yearling for us at Saratoga. And, uh, they shipped him by freight.

SMITH: Hmm. Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: Yep. And one more thing that I neglected to tell you. When I was real young, um, see--te-, te-, ten or twelve years old, my dad took me up to the corner of Leestown and the Yarnallton Pike and watched Mereworth Farm lead all their yearlings to the Keeneland sale. During the war--

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: --you couldn't get the gas, you couldn't get the van. And I don't know if you're familiar with it, but that's, Yarnallton Pike and down the Elkchester Pike and all the way around--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --that was about a five or six mile walk with those horses. And it was just a string of 'em. And, and, uh--

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: --walking those horses to the sale. That was, that was something, 'cause I would not want to lead a yearling through all of that. That would be scary, but, uh--

SMITH: Huh.

GREATHOUSE: --it was--

SMITH: Was that unusual, even in--

GREATHOUSE: Oh.

SMITH: --those times?

GREATHOUSE: Oh, yeah. You didn't put a yearling on the road--(laughs)- -on a hard road, that far. But, uh, I was too young to appreciate it. But, uh, that was the only way they were gonna get 'em over there.

SMITH: Hmm. Yeah, that was a hard time. Uh--

GREATHOUSE: It was.

SMITH: --of course, it, Keeneland sale was created because of that.

GREATHOUSE: Um-hm.

SMITH: But, uh--

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, it, uh, made, uh, a kind of an impression when you're twelve or thirteen years old, but you're really, you know, uh--

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: --no gas. You know, you only got food st-, uh, you got stamps for your shoes and things like that. But I didn't pay too 01:34:00much attention to it till I'll got older, then realized what really a sacrifice it was. And, uh, losing so many boys.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, uh, it was a, it was a tough time. And--

SMITH: Now you lived through the Depression as well. Was that something you were aware of? You were pretty young.

GREATHOUSE: Well, the--your parents didn't talk much about it. But can you imagine when the bank closed, the--you didn't even, you know, there was no insurance or anything. I think that dad and mom came from Minnesota to Kentucky, I think they had thirty-five dollars.

SMITH: Shoo.

GREATHOUSE: That's all they had. And no jobs.

SMITH: Hmm. Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: That's tough.

SMITH: That's very tough.

GREATHOUSE: That is tough.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, you know, but they, but they made it. And, uh, and 01:35:00then this generation and the Henry Whites of this world--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --and all we, you, we have a hard time dealing with what's going on now. But it--I never figured when I'd retire I'd pay four dollars a gallon for gasoline either. (both laugh)

SMITH: --absolutely not--

GREATHOUSE: So, so everybody, everybody goes through some, some kind of disappointment--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --but, uh, and, uh--

SMITH: Well, it's not the Depression. It's, it's not, but, uh--

GREATHOUSE: That, that's right.

SMITH: --but there's always a challenge.

GREATHOUSE: There's always a challenge. And there's always a, a bright side.

SMITH: Now one of the times that was particularly challenging for the horse industry was the late eighties when everything had gotten so--

GREATHOUSE: So big.

SMITH: --so big and then shoo--

GREATHOUSE: Yep, baby.

SMITH: Did that impact your work at all?

GREATHOUSE: Oh yes. Uh, and if I'm not mistaken, was that when they 01:36:00changed the, the tax laws?

SMITH: Yes.

GREATHOUSE: That's, that's, that's what did it. And, uh, and, uh, well, a lot of farms just closed down.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: Just, just, and, uh, it, it really, it really hurt. And, uh--

SMITH: So did it cut into your business? Did you--

GREATHOUSE: No, I, I, I did not lose one, because all of my, all of mine were pretty well-established.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, uh, the, uh, farms that I working on were able to, to--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --withstand it or, or, or cut down, they cut down on it. Yeah, they cut down on, they get rid of or sold some of the horses 01:37:00that weren't gonna make 'em any money.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: That's for sure. I mean the, the numbers went down.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: But I, I didn't have a farm completely go out that I worked on, like so many of 'em did.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh--

SMITH: Um-hm. No, it's built back up. So, uh, did you know many--any other, um, blacksmiths who had problems at that time, with the downturn in the business?

GREATHOUSE: Yes. Uh, one, and, uh, he had--I think he had two farms that went out. I'd rather not name them. It wouldn't be proper.

SMITH: You talked about when you first started how, um, and there were only fifteen blacksmiths that you all would occasionally gather at 01:38:00the, um, Mr. Tompkins's place or where he had the forge and, um, share stories and things. Did--

GREATHOUSE: Oh yeah.

SMITH: --is there--

GREATHOUSE: And, and at our houses. Yeah.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: We'd, we'd, we'd, uh, uh, the--Gale Pelster had a-- [telephone rings]

SMITH: Let's see if she-- [telephone rings]

GREATHOUSE: --Gale Pelster had a, uh, house with about two and a half acres. And he'd, he'd grill out a lot and they'd all go out there and, and, uh, visit and, and, uh, have fun a couple time, couple times each summer. And, uh, it was nice.

SMITH: So there was a lot of camaraderie within the--

GREATHOUSE: Right.

SMITH: --blacksmiths?

GREATHOUSE: --and then we had a poker night. And, uh, several of us 01:39:00would play poker. And, uh, it was a, yeah, it, it was a close-knit bunch.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: We had to be.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: 'Cause we had to depend on each other 'cause if somebody got hurt, we needed to, needed somebody to help with the, with the business.

SMITH: Um-hm.

MRS. GREATHOUSE: I'm getting rid of some old tomatoes. (Smith laughs)

SMITH: So did that--how did that change? I mean--when did you see a really significant growth in the blacksmiths?

GREATHOUSE: Uh, in the mid- to late-eighties.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: That's when it started back again, when, when the--

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: --when the farms got big. I guess we could almost n-, name 'em, you know. Coolmore got big. Mrs. Abercrombie.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, uh, of course all the Arab farms--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --uh, they just mushroomed. And, uh, some horseshoers maybe only had two farms with seven hundred or eight hundred head of horses on each one. And, which I would have never heard of, you know, of course Claiborne today, I think, has that many.

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh--

SMITH: Is there--do the farriers in Kentucky, do, is there an organization or is it still--

GREATHOUSE: They--we had a Bluegrass Horseshoers Association for years and years. And I served as president for three, three different terms.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, in the last five or six years it just dropped out. And, uh, they haven't, they haven't had an organization. Kind of miss it because we'd have meetings at the Gluck Center.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: We'd have, uh, Dr. Rooney and, uh, some of the veterinarians 01:41:00from around here to speak to us and tell us what's, what's new in the business. And, uh, it was really informative. And kind of--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --miss it. University was very nice about letting us use the Gluck Center.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And I guess the highlight was when Dr. Rooney had a, a confirmation class for six Wednesdays straight. And so then we just got busy and we invited a lot of the horse people and things, and we'd- -there was maybe seventy-five to a hundred people there every night.

SMITH: Oh.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, of course Dr. Rooney did a lot of work. Uh, he did a, a lot of autopsies. And he, he went from the, from the nose to the tail. And it was very informative. And everybody really enjoyed 01:42:00it. It was--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --maybe a highlight of, of my presidency--(laughs)--I'd say, that we, that-- 'cause it helps the--inform other people on what makes, what makes a horse work.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: (coughs) And, uh, then we'd be met at, we met at Hagyard's sometimes. Uh, we met at Rood and Riddle's.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, it, uh, I don't know if it's too busy or maybe I'm too old.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: But, um, I miss that.

SMITH: Um-hm. Are there still any of the ones you worked with in those early years that are still around?

GREATHOUSE: No. As, as Jackie said, "Glenn, you're the last of the George Tompkins' heir."

SMITH: Really?

GREATHOUSE: (clears throat) That frightened me. (laughs) Right.

SMITH: Huh. Huh. Well, um, you've talked a lot about Jackie being a 01:43:00perfectionist. What about Tompkins, was he? Or was he just--I mean it seems like he was so unusual in that he worked with so many different horses. And you described him at one point as an artist.

GREATHOUSE: Okay, Jackie--I can tell you a story that Jackie told not long ago. Jack said when I was with him for about a year, one of the, uh, men at the trodding track said he had a horse that was going off, there's something wrong with his gait. So George said, "Meet me at the track and put him in the buggy at 6:30 in the morning." So George and Jack went out there, pitch dark. And he said George put his head down on the rail.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And then told, told the trainer, he said, "Bring him to the shop in, in, in about an hour and I'll take care of him." (laughs) So 01:44:00he went in and he shod the horse, made these, what they call a diamond shaped shoe in the back. Jackie said, "I wrote it all down, exactly what he did." Took the horse out. The trainer came back and said, "Perfect. He's going just right." Said it wasn't a month later, another fellow came by and said, "I've got a horse that's got a problem." So he says, "Meet me at 6:30 in the morning." Same story. Put his head down, listened, brought him in. But he made the shoe different than he did the first horse. And the horse went fine. Then Jackie said, "How come you did this horse this way and this one the other way?" He says, 01:45:00"I'm not gonna tell you," he says, "because you're, you're not that far advanced and you don't need to know, because you, it's gonna mess you up." And he said, "It made me mad." But he said, "After a while, after I was added another year or two, I understand what he meant, because it's gonna be too confusing." In other words, it was too technical for you. But he said, it really hurt his feelings. But--

SMITH: Oh.

GREATHOUSE: --uh, so that's the way George was. He could never explain anything to you, but he could do it.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: And it was very odd.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, he, he was just a, and, uh, you can see his picture there. His, his--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: He had the long arms. When he'd bend over, his hands would almost touch the floor.

SMITH: Huh.

GREATHOUSE: He was, and, uh, he would just, just so easy under a horse. He just, it was so, just so smooth, he just, he just flowed when he 01:46:00worked.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: And he'd go to the anvil and he'd work the shoe over, it would fit. (laughs) He didn't have to go back the second time. (laughs)

SMITH: Did you ever develop a sense for what a horse needed?

GREATHOUSE: Uh, yes and no, because I didn't do that kind of work.

SMITH: Right.

GREATHOUSE: I've called Jackie a couple times.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And told him I was having problem with a horse that came off the track that was doing something. And then he'd say, "Well, don't do this to him 'cause that won't work."

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: Then he'd tell me the confirmation of the horse over the phone. He said, "He's long legged and short bodied, isn't he? And he's hitting?" I said, "That's right." So--

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: --you'd dial it up. That's what the camaraderie came with these fifteen or sixteen of us that were in this area that if one of 'em had that problem we, we would--did not hesitate to call.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: A phone call's a lot cheaper than monkeying around.

SMITH: Oh absolutely.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh--

SMITH: Well, and if you had respect for each other and knew, knew who might know--

GREATHOUSE: That's right.

SMITH: --something.

GREATHOUSE: Because some of 'em were, like I say, shodded the trotters and, uh--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --and they had different, different ways of, of, uh, stopping different problems.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, I think maybe that's what keeps you going, is a few problems. If it was the same thing day after day after day, it would get monotonous.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: But then once in a while you get a little challenge. And maybe you'll win a few. (both laugh)

SMITH: Now did you ever go to the tracks much? Did you go to races? Were you interested in the horses that way?

GREATHOUSE: Oh yeah, I love, love to go to races. Love to watch the, uh, go, go look at the stake horses--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --see what they'd look like, especially the fillies.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: The champion fillies when they'd have these--go out to Keeneland and, uh, uh, they were all shapes and sizes.

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: That's one thing we can't tell when you buy a horse is the heart, if they want to run.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: You can see a horse that's got a beautiful body, got everything going for it. They don't want to run.

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: And how do you explain--(laughs)--it? I had a trainer--

SMITH: Oh.

GREATHOUSE: --once said, "Tell an owner he's got an ugly wife. But never tell him he's got a horse that can't run." (both laugh) It's the hardest thing to tell somebody, the horse can't run.

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: Mack Miller was a, a good judge of, of horses. And, uh, he, he was just very, very, uh, he, he didn't get wound up with, with the hype of, uh, trying to be number one and--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --you know, and the--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --on television and all. He just liked to take one step 01:49:00back. And he said, "Let the, let the owners get up there. They're the ones paying the bills." And I thought that was kind of a nice, nice statement, that, uh--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --and I had a particular horse that was a good horse, but boy he bred the worst knees on it you ever saw. When I asked Mr. Miller once, I said, uh, "What do you think about this sire? Think he's going to make a, a good sire? Gonna get some runners?" He said, "Young man," he said, "If you find any by him, you send 'em to me. I'll take every one he's got."

SMITH: Oh.

GREATHOUSE: So he--they could, they could outrun their deformity or outrun their--

SMITH: Um-hm, confirmation problems.

GREATHOUSE: --outrun their confirmation, um-hm.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: And so that's what--

SMITH: You can't tell.

GREATHOUSE: --so good about the game. No. If we could, it'd all--

SMITH: Oh.

GREATHOUSE: --there, there wouldn't be but twenty-five or thirty horses bought. They'd all buy the stake horses.

SMITH: That's right.

GREATHOUSE: But you can't tell.

SMITH: Did you ever buy a horse?

GREATHOUSE: Oh yeah. I've had a couple in training. Enjoy it thoroughly. And, uh, it's just so much fun.

SMITH: Yeah. Had any luck with 'em?

GREATHOUSE: Yeah, they were both claimers. But, uh, they paid their way. And it was just fun to go watch 'em run. And, uh, it's, uh, it's just, uh, it's an expensive--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --thing. But, uh, it, uh--

SMITH: Where did they run?

GREATHOUSE: Oh, they ran at, uh, at Churchill and, uh, at Turfway. And they weren't, they weren't the caliber to--when you go to Keeneland, you better have a runner.

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: I don't even care, even if it's a claimer. You better have a runner, 'cause everybody wants to have their picture taken at Keeneland. (laughs)

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: You can't blame 'em. Beautiful track.

SMITH: Yes it is.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh--

SMITH: Yes it s.

GREATHOUSE: --I'm sure you've had plenty of people talk about Mr. Headley, uh.

SMITH: Uh, yeah. Yeah, did you know him?

GREATHOUSE: Uh, I saw him a lot around the track. My dad knew him very well.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, he, uh, he would-- he could get things done. And, uh, he, he, uh, and, you know, when I started out too, you, you didn't see women on the racetrack. You didn't see 'em on the farm. And I was out there one morning and this big Cadillac stopped and this gentleman got out and a lady was with him, young lady. And I said, "Who is that?" And they said, "Well, that's Mr. Headley." Said, "His sight has gone bad. And that's his daughter, Alice, bringing him to the barn to see some of his horses." And that was the first time I, I, I saw Mrs. Chandler.

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, a horseman, no, and she is terrific. I'd love to, 01:52:00I'd love to listen to her.

SMITH: Oh?

GREATHOUSE: I'd, I'd love to get in on a conversation. She and Mrs. Abercrombie both--

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: --they're, they're, but, uh, getting back to the women, but now, you know, it's just, you know, they're, they're in the breeding sheds and they're in the management and everything else, as it should be.

SMITH: Now they, um--

GREATHOUSE: 'Cause they're, they're a little bit easier with horses. They're easier around 'em.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: But, uh, it was just, the, the, those trainers that I grew up with wouldn't hire 'em.

SMITH: No. No, and Mrs. Chandler and I talked about when she, um, started Mill Ridge. You know, it was tough as a, a woman, even one--

GREATHOUSE: That's right.

SMITH: --who had grown up in the industry.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh--

SMITH: So--

GREATHOUSE: --she, uh, she's proved that she can do it. I tell you. 01:53:00'Cause she's raised some wonderful horses.

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --she's a good student too. She--

SMITH: Um-hm. Yes, I, I really enjoyed talking with her and Miss Abercrombie. And, uh, uh, not, obviously not as many women. I have not interviewed as many women, because there aren't as many as, um, when I'm talking about from the older generations--

GREATHOUSE: Right.

SMITH: --to interview, so--

GREATHOUSE: That's right.

SMITH: --uh, we'll see how that changes as I get to more of the farm workers themselves. Well, we've talked about a lot of things. But I'm sure that there are lots of stories that I haven't touched on that you could share. Is there anything you can think of that we haven't talked about?

GREATHOUSE: Um, maybe touch on the Bradley Farm a little bit. I don't know if--

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: --you were aware of the Bradley Farm, consisted of what is, 01:54:00what was King Ranch, Idle Hour--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --and then Danada Farm.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, that was all one big farm when I was growing up and I lived with-- on the corner there, the Leestown and Valley Pike, which is only about a mile, mile and a half. And Bracktown--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --the little settlement, most all those people or most of the men worked for Mr. Bradley.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: See, he had his own racetrack there.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: That was, that's where King Ranch is now. That is where the racetrack was.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, there was a little bar or a little roadhouse, as they called 'em back then in the forties, right across from the entrance of the, uh, narcotic hospital.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, uh, you'd, you'd drive down there and there were all the jockeys and, uh, the exercise boys and some farm help there 01:55:00getting 'em a beer every night. And, uh, it was just like a big, big gathering.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, you'd see the, the, uh, what was going on. Because Mr. Bradley had his, uh, own quarters for the--jockey quarters on the farm too, that they stayed there.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And it was a big, big operation. And then they'd stop traffic on the old Frankfort Pike sometimes to lead the horses from one side of the road to the other.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: Especially when they were weaning. They'd leave the weanlings on one side and take the mares onto the other side, isn't all. And to a eleven, twelve-year-old, it was just cool to watch, watch what was going on. But that was, that was a big, big operation.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: And then you'd take, uh, Hamburg Farm with two thousand acres, Idle Hour with twelve hundred, Calumet eight hundred, Walnut 01:56:00Hall two thousand or better, Castleton one thousand, Mereworth one thousand, Coldstream one thousand, Elmendorf two thousand plus.

SMITH: Hmm.

GREATHOUSE: And the C.V. Whitney Farm, can you just imagine how many acres in Fayette County were devoted to the horses even back then.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, it was, uh, started to be what we call the Bluegrass State, what makes it what it is. Everybody says when they fly over Calumet coming in, it is the most beautiful sight they've ever seen and they want to come back.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: So it's an eye-catcher. But--

SMITH: But a lot of that acreage is gone now.

GREATHOUSE: Yeah.

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: But, uh, it, uh, yeah, so Hamburg is half--

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: --gone.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh--

SMITH: And, uh, Beaumont Farm.

GREATHOUSE: Beaumont. Oh my goodness. It ran from, uh, Campbell House 01:57:00clear to the South Elkhorn Creek.

SMITH: Right.

GREATHOUSE: But when I was growing up it was just huge, huge place.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: It's--I couldn't imagine one man operating all of that and building Keeneland at the same--(laughs)--time. But, uh, of course--

SMITH: Can he--

GREATHOUSE: --he didn't do it all. He had--

SMITH: Yeah.

GREATHOUSE: --other good help too. But, uh--

SMITH: He was leading the way.

GREATHOUSE: I'm sure Alice had a lot of stories about that.

SMITH: Yes, about her dad and--

GREATHOUSE: About her dad.

SMITH: --going to Keeneland as a young girl and playing at Keeneland while it was being built. So.

GREATHOUSE: It's, uh, it's, uh, quite a unique industry. And I hope our 2010 games turn out real well.

SMITH: Yes, yes I do too.

GREATHOUSE: We got a lot to do.

SMITH: So you've been out at the horse park as an advisor?

GREATHOUSE: N-, with, just with the farrier, uh, building.

SMITH: Okay.

GREATHOUSE: We've put an addition on it and we're gonna put some horseshoe displays and some other things in there and try to change 'em 01:58:00every four, five months--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --from now until 2010. And we're gonna make a video and hopefully have so-, a, a Thoroughbred shoer telling, this is what we put on a Thoroughbred.

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: And then get a Standardbred man to show, this is how, the shoes we put on the Standardbred horse. Then the gaited horse--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --and all of this. And try to keep it simple--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --because you get too technical with just people that walk through. They, they get bored.

SMITH: Right.

GREATHOUSE: Just keep it simple. And, uh, we're, we're, we're hopefully we can get, get started on, on some of that, uh, maybe by this fall--

SMITH: Um-hm.

GREATHOUSE: --and, uh, and really promote, uh, the, the whole program out there.

SMITH: Well, maybe some of our interviews can help the, uh--

GREATHOUSE: Pardon?

SMITH: Maybe some of the interviews we collect can help with--

GREATHOUSE: Yeah.

SMITH: --with some of that. I'll, I work with Bill Cooke out at the horse park, so--

GREATHOUSE: Well, that, that was Bill Cooke that called me.

SMITH: Yeah, so--

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, he, uh--

SMITH: He's one of our advisors. So he's aware of what we're doing.

GREATHOUSE: Well, you know, he married Helen Evans' (??) daughter.

SMITH: Oh I, I didn't know that connection.

GREATHOUSE: Um-hm.

SMITH: Okay. Okay.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, so, so he's, he's worked hard out there.

SMITH: Yes, he has.

GREATHOUSE: And, uh, but there's a lot, you know, just a lot to do. And we need a lot of volunteers.

SMITH: Absolutely.

GREATHOUSE: And--

SMITH: It's--those two years are gonna go by very fast.

GREATHOUSE: Very quickly.

SMITH: Well, if you can't think of anything else right now, um, I'll be getting you a copy of the tape. Can you, see, check your notes, see if there's anything we've forgotten?

GREATHOUSE: No, I think you've covered most of it.

SMITH: Okay. Well, I'm sure that when you have a chance to listen to the interview, you'll think of something. And I'll be happy to, to come back and, uh, uh, see what else we can--

GREATHOUSE: Okay.

SMITH: --can pull out of your memories.

GREATHOUSE: (laughs) Okay.

SMITH: I'll go ahead and stop right now.

[End of interview.]