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Partial Transcript: This is Barbara Rylko-Bauer and I am conducting an interview today with Linda Bennett for the Society for Applied Anthropology's oral history project.
Segment Synopsis: Bennett discusses how she became interested in applied anthropology when she attended American University for her anthropology doctoral degree. She talks about how she was offered a position at George Washington University Medical Center to work on generational alcoholism. Bennett recalls her experiences with the Anthropological Society of Washington as a graduate student. She also talks about joining the Washington Association of Professional Anthropologists.
Keywords: Anthropological organizations; Anthropological societies; Applied anthropologists; Generational alcoholism; Long-term degree plans; Professional anthropologists; Washington Association of Professional Anthropologists (WAPA); Washington, D.C.
Subjects: American University (Washington, D.C.); Anthropological Society of Washington (Washington, D.C.); Anthropologists; Anthropology; Applied anthropology; George Washington University. Medical Center; Washington (D.C.); Washington Association of Professional Anthropologists
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Partial Transcript: Um, so when you then became pre--president, um, from that, you know those, um, what was it, three years that you were president?
Segment Synopsis: Bennett discusses her time as the president of the Washington Association of Professional Anthropologists for three years. She talks about what she learned while president, including taking responsibility for the actions of the association.
Keywords: Anthropological associations; Leadership skills in organization management; Organizational presidents; Washington Association of Professional Anthropologists (WAPA); Washington, D.C.
Subjects: Anthropologists; Anthropology; Bennett, Linda A.; Washington (D.C.); Washington Association of Professional Anthropologists
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Partial Transcript: And, during that time, I had my a-applied anthropology work in Washington, D.C., but I also had, parallel with that, uh, work I was, uh, doing in former Yugoslavia.
Segment Synopsis: Bennett talks about her enjoyment with working on an interdisciplinary project. She discusses the details of the project, which was transmission or non-transmission of alcoholism in American families. Bennett recalls the different kinds of anthropologists she worked with, including medical and cultural anthropologists. She also discusses the differences of the research in the United States and in Yugoslavia.
Keywords: Anthropological projects; Anthropology--Eastern Europe; Generational alcoholism; Parallel anthropological fieldwork; Research funding; Transmissible alcoholism
Subjects: Alcoholism; Anthropologists; Anthropology; Anthropology--Fieldwork; Anthropology--Research; Applied anthropology; Yugoslavia; Zagreb (Croatia)
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Partial Transcript: Well, I think, um, you know, you finished your, uh, uh, tenure with WAPA in 1984.
Segment Synopsis: Bennett talks about how the National Association for the Practice of Anthropology (NAPA) was created in 1983 in Washington, D.C. She discusses why NAPA was formed and how many associations needed to restructure due to new tax laws in the 1980s. Bennett also talks about how these organizations needed to appeal to applied anthropology, as opposed to only appealing to anthropology within academia. She recalls her position on the board of NAPA and its general structure and organization.
Keywords: Anthropological associations; Anthropological societies; National Association for the Practice of Anthropology (NAPA); Organizational structures; Professional societies; Washington, D.C.
Subjects: Anthropologists; Anthropology; Applied anthropology; National Association for the Practice of Anthropology (U.S.); Washington (D.C.)
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Partial Transcript: Well, you were in Memphis at the time.
Segment Synopsis: Bennett talks about the formation of the Mid-South Association of Practicing Anthropologists in Memphis in the early 1990s after she had moved to the area from Washington, D.C.
Keywords: Anthropological associations; Anthropological societies; Applied anthropological associations; Mid-South Association of Practicing Anthropologists
Subjects: Anthropologists; Anthropology; Applied anthropology; Memphis (Tenn.); Professional associations.
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Partial Transcript: Because by then, I mean, NAPA had evolved.
Segment Synopsis: Bennett discusses the evolution of the National Association for the Practice of Anthropology (NAPA) during her term as president. She tells the interviewer her biggest achievement while being president was the creation of the Careers in Anthropology video. Bennett talks about working with the American Anthropological Association (AAA) on the video and how the applied anthropology field became more accepted by the AAA. She recalls starting career workshops and a mentorship program while she was president of NAPA
Keywords: American Anthropological Association (AAA); Anthropological associations--United States; Anthropological organizations; Anthropological societies; Career services; National Association for the Practice of Anthropology (NAPA)
Subjects: American Anthropological Association; Anthropologists; Anthropology; Applied anthropology; National Association for the Practice of Anthropology (U.S.); Vocational guidance
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Partial Transcript: Um, but in the pro--I mean, during that time period then, from, let's say from '94 to '98, um, you know, you, you were involved with the SFAA at the same time as you were involved in NAPA?
Segment Synopsis: Bennett compares her experiences with the National Association for the Practice of Anthropology (NAPA) with her experience with the Society for Applied Anthropology (SfAA). She discusses the distinctions between the people who join each organization, including the percentage of practitioners in each organization compared to academic anthropologists.
Keywords: Academic anthropologists; Anthropological organizations; Anthropological societies; Applied anthropologists; National Association for the Practice of Anthropology (NAPA); Organizational meetings; Practitioners; Society for Applied Anthropology (SfAA)
Subjects: Anthropologists; Anthropology; Applied anthropology; National Association for the Practice of Anthropology (U.S.); Society for Applied Anthropology
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Partial Transcript: Um, during your tenure in the SFAA, what were, you know, some of the key issues and--or key initiatives that you were involved in?
Segment Synopsis: Bennett talks about her goals as president of the Society for Applied Anthropology (SFAA). Her first goal was to interconnect applied anthropology departments from different universities across the country, which Bennett calls the Consortium. Bennett names the universities who came to the Consortium. She discusses how the organization is independent from other anthropological organizations, though they are linked to the SfAA and a few other organizations.
Keywords: Anthropological associations; Anthropology consortium; Applied anthropology--Education; Consortium of Practicing and Applied Anthropologists; Independent associations; Society for Applied Anthropology (SfAA); Society for Applied Anthropology Consortium
Subjects: Anthropologists; Anthropology; Applied anthropology; Bennett, Linda A.; Society for Applied Anthropology
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Partial Transcript: What about, um, um, curriculum development?
Segment Synopsis: Bennett discusses curriculum development in anthropology departments throughout colleges and universities in the United States. She talks about the importance of curriculum development in anthropology, particularly developing internship and practicum credits.
Keywords: Anthropology departments; Anthropology--Academia; Consortium of Practicing and Applied Anthropologists; Curriculum development
Subjects: Anthropologists; Anthropology; Applied anthropology; Bennett, Linda A.; Career changes
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Partial Transcript: Are you still involved with COPAPIA--or, or COP--COPAA?
Segment Synopsis: Bennett talks about her continued involvement with the Consortium of Practicing and Applied Anthropologists.
Keywords: Anthropological associations; Anthropological organizations; Careers in anthropology; Committee on Practicing, Applied and Public Interest Anthropology (COPAPIA); Consortium of Practicing and Applied Anthropologists (COPAA); Consortiums
Subjects: Anthropologists; Anthropology; Anthropology research and developments; Applied anthropology; Bennett, Linda A
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Partial Transcript: But what is the relationship between NAPA and COPAPIA?
Segment Synopsis: Bennett discusses how NAPA and COPAPIA differ from each other, even though they are both related to the practice of applied anthropology.
Keywords: Anthropological associations; Anthropological societies; Committee on Practicing, Applied and Public Interest Anthropology (COPAPIA); Consortium of Practicing and Applied Anthropologists (COPAA); National Association for the Practice of Anthropology (NAPA)
Subjects: Anthropologists; Anthropology; Applied anthropology; Bennett, Linda A.; National Association for the Practice of Anthropology (U.S.)
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Partial Transcript: You mentioned, um, that you're now the Associate Dean at the University of Memphis.
Segment Synopsis: Bennett talks about her work at the University of Memphis in the anthropology department. She discusses writing a chapter of a book about the history of the anthropology program at the University of Memphis. She recalls developing the applied anthropology department at the University of Memphis, including the stipulations given to the program. Bennett talks about some of the efforts of the University of Memphis graduate students to create anthropologically-based programs in the Memphis area, one of the stipulations stated to create the program.
Keywords: Anthropology departments; Anthropology--Education; Anthropology--Graduate programs; Development of academic programs; University of Memphis--Anthropology program
Subjects: Anthropologists; Anthropology; Medical anthropology; Memphis (Tenn.); Universities and colleges--Graduate work.; University of Memphis
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Partial Transcript: Any other, kind of, concluding thoughts, or...
Segment Synopsis: Bennett discusses the "happenstances" which led her into a graduate degree program in anthropology. She talks about why she chose anthropology as her subject to become a professor of, including how she enjoyed the terminology of the field. Bennett recalls another "happenstance," in which she became acquainted with the faculty at the American University to work on a multidisciplinary project.
Keywords: "Happenstances"; Anthropology professors; Applied anthropologists; Career decisions
Subjects: American University (Washington, D.C.); Anthropologists; Anthropology; Applied anthropology; Archaeology; Bennett, Linda A.; College teachers; Interviewing
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Partial Transcript: Where do you see, from all your historical, you know, knowledge, um, experience, uh, the involvement that you've had on so many different levels in applied anthropology, where do you see this discipline, you know, going?
Segment Synopsis: Bennett discusses what she believes is the future of applied anthropology, which should involve modifying educational programs to prepare students for their professional lives. She believes anthropology departments should shift what they believe are "good" careers for their students.
Keywords: Academia; Anthropologists in corporations; Anthropology departments; Anthropology--Academia; Applied anthropologists
Subjects: Anthropologists; Anthropology; Applied anthropology; Bennett, Linda A.; Careers & opportunities
RYLKO-BAUER: This is Barbara Rylko-Bauer, and I am, uh, conducting an
interview today with Linda Bennett for the Society for Applied Anthropology's oral history project. Um, today is November 18th, 2011, and the interview is occurring at the annual AAA meetings, annual American Anthropological Association meetings, um, that are being held in Montreal, Quebec. Um, I think, Linda, that, uh, maybe we could start by--well, first of all, welcome.BENNETT: (laughs) Thank you. I'm glad to be here.
RYLKO-BAUER: Yes, it's--I'm really look forward to, uh, uh, talking with you and
learning a lot about--in the process about, you know, the development of applied anthropology, because you've done so much, um, in the discipline, uh, in research and writing and teaching and, you know, um, organizational development 00:01:00and so forth. And, uh, I thought it would make sense just to start from the beginning, you know--BENNETT: Okey-doke, yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: --how you got into applied anthropology--
BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: -- and, uh--
BENNETT: Okay. Well, I think, uh, specifically applied anthropology, my movement
in that direction occurred when I made a decision to go to American University for my, uh, doctorate. And, uh, when I knew American University, which was a new doctoral program, had a new doctoral program at that time, um, was, of course, located in Washington, D.C., and that was what I considered or s-, picked up as being the center of applied anthropology in the country.RYLKO-BAUER: And why did you think that?
BENNETT: Oh, because of all the work that was being done in government, and--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --just the dispersion of people throughout, um, different, different
parts of the--mostly government work--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --in the city. And that--also, the department said (laughter) that
00:02:00that's what their interest was in, in developing their doctoral program. And so just the decision to go to Washington, American University, set me in that direction. And, I must say, that was a departure from what I had actually planned to do, uh, the previous year, which was to go to University of Colorado, Boulder and become a biological anthropologist.RYLKO-BAUER: Oh, interesting.
BENNETT: So I, I--(laughs)--went and made a major change in my long-term career
plans. And then, um, being, um--at the time I was all--I was completing my dissertation at American University, I had an opportunity for a new position, uh, at, uh, George Washington University Medical Center in psychiatry, to come in and to work collaboratively with, uh, uh, colleagues from other disciplines on a gr-, new grant on alcoholism, uh, transmission over generations of American families. So in some ways, even though I had an earlier, more general interest 00:03:00in being--becoming an applied anthropologist, it was this twelve-year history with, um, uh, Center for Family Research at GW that launched me in a very, uh, explicit kind of way.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: So those were--that was kind of the beginning.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm. And, um, you, um--when did you start getting involved in the
local anthropological organizations, and which ones there in Washington?BENNETT: Well, as a graduate student, I immediately started going to meetings of
the, uh, Anthropological Society of Washington, which is the oldest American, um, anthropology organization that's been continuously, um, in existence. And, uh, it, um, it had members who were from all the academic institutions in the city: the Smithsonian Institution, the NIH [National Institutes of Health]. It was a hodgepodge and very interesting mix of anthropologists. And so they would 00:04:00have monthly meetings, and I just got used to going to their meetings. And, um, in the midseventies, the Washington Association of Professional Anthropologists was created, which was a very different kind of group, and a very interesting, very vibrant kind of group of practitioners and some academic people. And a happenstance moment occurred, uh, when I was finishing up my dissertation and I was working at, uh, GW, and the, the, the director of the Center for Family Research, David Reese, psychiatrist, took me out to lunch. And, uh, one of the things he, uh, made a point to say was even though I was working outside of anthropology, per se, but as an anthropologist, it was really important for me to stay active within my discipline.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: So I took that to heart, and I--one of the ways to do that in
Washington was to be very active in both the ASW and WAPA [Washington 00:05:00Association of Professional Anthropologists], which I was, um, basically at the same time.RYLKO-BAUER: When did you first, uh, become engaged with WAPA? I mean, how, how,
how many years after--? 'Cause I think WAPA was--uh, it was begun, uh, like, in 1976 or something like that?BENNETT: I believe it was '76, and, uh, so I think I must've been one of the
early people who started going to meetings.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: Um, I'd been going to ASW earlier, 'cause it, it was around. So, uh, I
w--I was--I can't tell you precisely what year, (laughs) but I think it was pretty early on--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --that I heard, um, about it being formed.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And it was, uh--you know, a lot of life in Washington, uh, focuses on
work, dinner parties, and going to meetings, so-- (both laugh)RYLKO-BAUER: Were they able to combine those in WAPA?
BENNETT: Yes, a lot of combi-, combination. Yes.
RYLKO-BAUER: So, um, what do you remember from that, you know, time period when
you were involved in WAPA? Because at one point in time, you, um, ended up 00:06:00becoming the president of WAPA, right? That was in--BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --1981 to 1984.
BENNETT: Um-hm. I believe that's, uh--
RYLKO-BAUER: So just a--really, just like six, five years after you finished
your PhD.BENNETT: Oh, yeah, mm-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah.
BENNETT: The, uh--it was a very vibrant organization, and, uh--I forget what
your question was. (laughs)RYLKO-BAUER: Oh. I was just wondering how you, you know, um--if you remember
some of the, er, you know, what was going on at that time in the organization, and, um, you know, how did you get to the point of becoming a president of WAPA. Uh, you know, and if you remember--BENNETT: Yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: --some of the issues that were--because this was early on, and, uh--
BENNETT: Yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: --is that one of the ear--earliest local, uh, professional
organiza--or practicing, uh--BENNETT: It was--
RYLKO-BAUER: It's an LPO, right?
BENNETT: It's an LPO--
RYLKO-BAUER: A local practitioner organization.
BENNETT: Yeah. There was one earlier in Arizona that then didn't continue, and
00:07:00so WAPA is currently--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --the oldest standing--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --l-, LPO. And, uh, it was a really interesting, uh, mixture of people,
um, of a variety of ages, but strong emphasis upon careers outside the traditional academic routes, uh, directions.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And, um, it was, uh--people, uh--my recollection is that there was a
sense of mission there, because it was a new idea--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --uh, and, uh, and the people who came to WAPA came from so many parts
of the city, so many different agencies, government organizations, universities, and that sort of--and it had a wide range of ages of people who were really active. And the part that I, I think that, uh--there were a lot of reasons why it was so lively and, um, there was a sense of commitment. It was partly that, 00:08:00uh, that it was very, uh--it was a functional organization in the sense it--people--if you were--if somebody came to town and they were looking for a job, if they were an anthropologist, first thing you would say, "You gotta go to WAPA meetings," and the networking really made a big difference there. And so there was the functionality of it that was so critical, but, at the same time, it was very social.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And I, I've always believed that in--the long-term life of an
organization, uh, is dependent so much on people actually just wanting to see each other--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --not just for functional reasons.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And I think WAPA was a good example of that.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm. Well, it's kind of--it sounds to me that it's recognizing
that our, um, you know--one's social life and one's professional life and the work that one does and all that are not separate things.BENNETT: Right, um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: You know, they, they all intersect--
BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --and it's healthier--
BENNETT: Yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: --when it's like that, yeah.
BENNETT: And it's very much that way in Washington--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
00:09:00BENNETT: --that, that interconnection.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um, so you've mentioned some of the roles that, that WAPA played
early on. Um, I'm assuming that they were very involved in helping to professionalize? Or, I mean--BENNETT: Yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: --people were already, obviously, in positions, uh, in government,
the anthropologists were. But were there some issues, some problems with, you know, actual kind of legitimacy, or how you define yourself, vis--vis, you know--as an anthropologist, vis--vis the work that you're doing in other disciplines? What were some of the questions that they were dealing with, and, and were they successful, you know, in, uh, addressing 'em.BENNETT: I think that that was a really important aspect, uh, because--for
people who were not in full-time academic positions. And, uh, because it was a-- It was that time to get together and to con-- to retain that sense of identity 00:10:00as an anthropologist. But it was also really important for--as a modeling place for the younger anthropologists--RYLKO-BAUER: Mm.
BENNETT: --coming up, (laughs) you know--
RYLKO-BAUER: Yes, mm-hm.
BENNETT: --through the various--'cause Washington has a lot of universities, um,
and there are, like, you know--there's more than one doctoral program. There's a couple doctoral programs.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: There's a third one now, Maryland, and lots of masters programs. And so
there were a lot of anthropologists, probably more in Washington than any single other city.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: So there was that--there was, there was that going on.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: But I think that there was a sense of specialness, um, and I enjoyed,
uh--as a footnote, I really enjoyed going to ASW meetings. I mean, they did things like--Margaret Mead was a speaker there. I mean, they did some really important, uh--they had important lectures, and they published their lecture series--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --every year, but it was, um, much more staid group--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --you know, or much more traditional group--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --than WAPA was. WAPA was, uh, definitely feeling on the cutting edge.
00:11:00RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm. Uh, were there--did they fulfill any functions in terms of
like--? I mean, one of the challenges must have been, um, you know, how you find jobs--BENNETT: Oh, i--
RYLKO-BAUER: -- in the public sector.
BENNETT: Very, very much, yes. And that was, uh, uh, um--I think that was a huge
motivation for a subset of people, at least, who came to WAPA consistently--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --was that it was a way to not just network with people in that area
but throughout the country.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: Because these people--there was a lot of--those who worked for the
State Department, USAID, um, Census Bureau, they were doing so many different kinds of things, and they would know things that you wouldn't know if you just hung out at American University.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm, um-hm.
BENNETT: It was the social networking--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --aspect.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm, um-hm. Were there--was there any training also that was
involved? Did they, um-- 00:12:00BENNETT: I can't remember if we did, uh--(laughs)--I'm trying to remember if
there were workshops--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --that were held at--you know, in Washington at WAPA meetings, but
what--I don't remember that happening, but I could be wrong.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: But what WAPA did was--I think WAPA insti--you know, they initiated
having training workshops at the, at the AAA meetings.RYLKO-BAUER: Oh, okay, the AAA meetings.
BENNETT: The AAA meetings--
RYLKO-BAUER: Okay, uh-huh.
BENNETT: --yes. And they probably did with SFAA, too, but I think, uh, AAA was--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --um, what are now--like, NAPA workshops--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --originally were probably WAPA workshops, but, of course, it's--
RYLKO-BAUER: Interesting, yeah.
BENNETT: --it's a very new--
RYLKO-BAUER: Right.
BENNETT: I mean, it's expanded phenomenally.
RYLKO-BAUER: Right.
BENNETT: But we--but WAPA used to--WAPA members put together workshops and, uh,
and they would, you know, frequently pay their own ways to go to wherever--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --the meetings were if they weren't in Washington.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
00:13:00BENNETT: I, I think the fact that we were in Washington, that AAA was located in
Washington helped that--RYLKO-BAUER: And we would--
BENNETT: --um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah, yeah.
BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: And--and I--the meetings cycled through Washington--
BENNETT: Absolutely, yes.
RYLKO-BAUER: --more frequently than they do now.
BENNETT: Yes, yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: 'Cause that's my sense--yeah.
BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: 'Cause I've been looking forward to going to Washington. (laughs)
BENNETT: Me, too! I'm going(??)--
RYLKO-BAUER: Why--
BENNETT: (laughs) Yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: It's not until 2014!
BENNETT: Yeah, yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: Do you, um--do you remember any person or people in particular
that, you know, uh, maybe, um, you know, you feel had a real important role in the evolution of this organization? And also--BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --in, in your own evolution leading up to you becoming president of
this organization?BENNETT: Well, uh, I remember having early--we met in different places, uh, like
at the Quaker Meeting House was probably the place we met most often during the time I was in Washington, but--RYLKO-BAUER: Where is that?
BENNETT: It's in Northwest Washington, near DuPont--
RYLKO-BAUER: Hm.
BENNETT: --Circle, um, on--I think it's R Street.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: Um, but we also had meetings at, uh, Shirley Fiske's house, not where
00:14:00she lives now but the--another house on Capitol Hill.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm. And what was Shirley doing at that time?
BENNETT: She was working--I think at that time, if I remember, she was working
for NOAA.RYLKO-BAUER: Okay.
BENNETT: And, uh, and so she was an--er--very active, also, in WAPA. Um, and on
audit--sorry--and Bob Wulff--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --very much. Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm. Well, and they ended up--
BENNETT: Um-hm, um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: I'm assuming that part of that involvement in--together led to--
BENNETT: The Praxis Award.
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah, yes. Well, and also the book that they--
BENNETT: Yes.
RYLKO-BAUER: It was one of the--
BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --early--
BENNETT: Yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: --applied anthropology collections.
BENNETT: Yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: I forget now what, what it was--the title of it. But, uh--
BENNETT: But the, the Praxis Award itself, uh, attracted a lot of attention to
WAPA. And, uh, in--and that was, you know, Bob and, and Shirley. 00:15:00RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: There were a--not everybody's still in Washington, but, um--but there
were--there was a very devoted group of people.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm. Um, so when you, then, become pre-, president, um, from
that--you know, those, um--what was it, three years that you were president?BENNETT: I think what it was, you--president elect--
RYLKO-BAUER: Okay, right.
BENNETT: --and then president.
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah.
BENNETT: Yeah, I think that's--
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah.
BENNETT: --what it was.
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah, that's, I think, what--how a lot of them--so kind of
short-hand in our discussion, we'll say president, but obviously--BENNETT: Umhm, yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: --there'll be president elective--
BENNETT: I think it was--
RYLKO-BAUER: --president--
BENNETT: Yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: --and then past president, or--
BENNETT: Yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah. But so, um, what--you know, can you think of several
different, um, uh, issues that you dealt with at the time, or initiatives, or, you know, some, uh--BENNETT: Uh--
RYLKO-BAUER: --interesting, uh, you know, developments that occurred during your
time there?BENNETT: One of the things--uh, I've mentioned something that I learned from
that experience. First of all-- 00:16:00RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --being WAPA president was, uh, ex--it required a lot of time and
attention to do--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --to try to do a good job at it. Um, and one of the things I learned,
which has held me in good stead over the years, about working in--with, with people in organizational matters, is that no matter how hard you work on some--no how--matter how hard you work and how much you attend to details, things will still go wrong--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and that you cannot, uh--and, and that, along with that, when things
go wrong, the best thing to do--it, it works--is to take responsibility--RYLKO-BAUER: Mm.
BENNETT: --even if you were not the one that was--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --cause of the, um--that doesn't work all the time, but it's amazing
how much it diffuses--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --irritation.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: But we had--I mean, because there was so much of a sense of devotion to
what WAPA was doing, I remember one very painful, um, meeting, and I won't mention names, between two members who--it was, I think, around the way of 00:17:00planning a workshop--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --that, uh, it got--it was at, at Shirley and Steve's house, and, and
it just got really, really uncomfortable. That was, uh, uh--so, I guess I mention that because it, it's as though you need to anticipate to be--when you're actively working in leadership in an organization that it is impossible to avoid conflict--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and, uh--
RYLKO-BAUER: Sure.
BENNETT: --issues that need to be if not resolved on the spot--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --worked through over time.
RYLKO-BAUER: So that was kind of a good, um, uh--
BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --chance to, to learn--
BENNETT: Yes.
RYLKO-BAUER: --the strategies that--
BENNETT: Yeah, um-hm, um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --you've obviously--
BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --I'm sure, had many opportunities to apply later on.
BENNETT: Yeah, that was, that was--and that was one that came out of the
blue--(laughs)--and I was totally blown away.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: Um, it wasn't really--didn't really involve me, but I happened to be
president at the time.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm, um-hm.
00:18:00BENNETT: So--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um, anything else that you want to say about that time period?
BENNETT: Um, during that--yeah, moved to Washington in 1970--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and left--in '86 we went to Memphis.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: Um, and during that time I had my applied anthropology work in
Washington, D.C., but I also had parallel with that, uh, work I was doing over in former Yugoslavia.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And, uh, and there were some cross-themes in the way--since I worked in
a department of psychiatry, and my colleagues on the research project included psychiatry--psychiatrists, psych-, psychologists, social worker, sometimes a sociologist, myself--you know, people who came from different disciplinary backgrounds and learned on the spot, uh, re--not just in theory--of all the 00:19:00great things that come out of having interdisciplinary--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --cooperation on a project, and where you draw upon differential strengths--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm, and--
BENNETT: --in making something work.
RYLKO-BAUER: --what was the project?
BENNETT: This was, um, uh, one of the first of three--there were three projects,
uh, over a twelve-year period on alcoholism in American families, and basically the transmission or non-transmission of alcoholism over generations of families, but from a, a socio-cultural point of view, rather than from a biological--RYLKO-BAUER: --------(??).
BENNETT: --point of view.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm, um-hm.
BENNETT: And--
RYLKO-BAUER: And was there a parallel study then going on in Yugos-, in the
former Yugoslavia?BENNETT: Uh--
RYLKO-BAUER: And which parts of--
BENNETT: Yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: --the former--
BENNETT: I worked in--my main home base in former Yugoslavia was in Croatia, in
Zagreb, but during the eighties I was, uh--I, I was--I worked in Slovenia and Serbia, as well, but my home base was always in, in Zagreb--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and in Croatia. But, um, I had in mind, uh, when I returned--I'd been
00:20:00first in Yugoslavia in 1970, and then for several months in '73, and then in and out through the--over the seventies, but I returned for two months, uh, with really good s-, uh, funding support, uh, in 1980, and my plan was--and this was-- a lot of lessons I learned this way, too, uh, uh, in terms of being flexible--(laughs)--uh, my plan was to try to replicate some of our research in, in, uh, Washington, among the--RYLKO-BAUER: Mm.
BENNETT: --h-, um, hospitalized patients, uh, being treated for alcoholism in
Zagreb at their main treatment, uh, program in, in, in that--in that republic. And, uh, got there and, uh, I had very good, uh, very good cooperation with, uh, the, uh, the, the chair of the department, and all of his colleagues. But immediately I realized that that was not going to make a lot of sense to do the 00:21:00same project as I had tried--that I had in mind doing.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: But one of the reasons why I got entry so, uh, so smoothly in 1980 was
that I had, um, several years under my belt of doing this work in a psychiatry department, being able to work with psychiatrists, in a very practical kind of problem and issue of alcoholism.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And so, because of that, they were very receptive to my, uh, my coming
and, and being in the hospital.RYLKO-BAUER: This is in Croatia?
BENNETT: In Croatia, yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: But, uh, but I also--I had opportunities there, uh, to do research that
I did--that was a very different kind of research than what I've ever done in the United States. And, uh, by being flexible and picking up on those opportunities, uh, really opened up a lot of, um--I mean, it was like for 00:22:00several years in the 1980s, so just, like, no end of, uh, w-, projects that I might have been either the lead on or a collaborator--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --with, and--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and I truly learned a lot about collaboration, cross-culturally and cross-disciplinarily--
RYLKO-BAUER: Mm, um-hm.
BENNETT: --over there. And my closest colleagues over the eighties and--still
come out of the biological anthropological field.RYLKO-BAUER: Interesting.
BENNETT: But they're--
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah.
BENNETT: --a mishmash of different, different--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --specializations in anthropology.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: That may be somewhat of a deviation, but--(laughs).
RYLKO-BAUER: Well, how was the re--um, and this is also a bit of a deviation,
but how was the research different? Is it--was it just the focus that it was more--uh, I mean, anthropology in Eastern Europe--BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --meant something different than it did here--
BENNETT: Yes, and--
RYLKO-BAUER: --to some extent.
BENNETT: Yes, and in, in, in Croatia, I have to say, my ties were with, um,
like, medical practitioners--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and with biological anthropologists, and, to some extent, linguists--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm, um-hm.
BENNETT: --uh, over there. Um, those were my strongest ties, rather than with ethnologists.
00:23:00RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm, right.
BENNETT: You know.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And, uh, and it partly had to do with just the work I'd been doing in
Washington, and, and when you establish--you know how it is; it's when you establish with people and they go well--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --then you build on those relationships, and you never know where it's
going to go.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: Um, and, I mean, we know that in the United States, but, uh, working
there made that even clearer.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm, um-hm.
BENNETT: You know.
RYLKO-BAUER: Well, I think if you work in another setting, uh, another cultural
setting, you, you come--you, you then turn around and look at--BENNETT: Right.
RYLKO-BAUER: --your home setting--
BENNETT: Yes.
RYLKO-BAUER: --through a different lens.
BENNETT: For the first time, I had never paid much attention to--I mean, I had
heard about alcoholism treatment in the course of doing so many interviews with people in the US, but I never really had spent much time focusing on the means of alcoholism treatment and the different modalities and that sort of thing. But 00:24:00when I got to Zagrev in 1980, that was my home base was smack middle in--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --the main treatment program. And it was great because, uh, it was
almost like, uh, learning how that system worked, but by a true criticism and observation.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And, uh, and then reflecting on what I thought I was observing and hearing--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --in that system.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: So--but I didn't know much about that. When I came back to the US, I
realized I knew a lot more about treating alcoholism over there--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --than I did in the US--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --other than Alcoholics Anonymous.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm. Well, I think, um, you know, you finished your, um, uh,
tenure at WAPA in 1984, and then you left Washington in '86.BENNETT: Eighty-six, yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm. And, um, you went to the University of Memphis, and we'll
00:25:00talk about that a little bit later.BENNETT: Okay.
RYLKO-BAUER: But, um, what led you to--at what point did you start getting
involved with, um, NAPA, the National Association for, um, the, uh, Practice of Anthropology?BENNETT: Well, NAPA was formed in 1983, if I'm correct--
RYLKO-BAUER: Formed in 1983.
BENNETT: --it was 1983, yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And, uh, there was--I was at the AAA meeting in--must've been in '83,
which there was this huge meeting about the formation of NAPA.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And the formation of NAPA was, in part, a response to the movement of
the Society for Applied Anthropology, um, uh, to become a totally independent 00:26:00entity, and without the AAA, um, handling its membership and its finances.RYLKO-BAUER: And did it have--before 1983, what was the re--what was the
relationship, uh, between the SfAA and--?BENNETT: I've actually been trying to document, 'cause I lived through that time
in Washington, and I have recollections, but I've been trying to, um, for a, a piece that Keri Brondo and I are writing, try to document exactly what happened when, and the reason. It was under, um, uh, a new tax law, or reinterpish--interpretation of the tax law that the tre--AAA needed to restructure--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --in the 1980s, early '80s. And it, it--the, the implication of that
restructuring meant that the Society for Applied Anthropology--if, if this is correct--I think this is the correct way it happened--could no longer be its own 00:27:00independent organization if they were to continue to be, uh, so-called managed, you know, in terms of membership and their accounting system and all that sort of thing by the AAA, that they either had to let that, that happen, and they would become--and I don't know what the language was at the time. I don't remember.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: It's--they didn't use the word "section," but, um, but they be-,
become, basically, a unit within the AAA, and--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --the Society For Applied Anthropology made a decision not to do that.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And they went independent, and, um, I was involved in their efforts to
basically, um, get on their--to, to make sure they were on their feet, their financial f-, footing in a very solid kind of way. It was not easy in the early years--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --um, for the SFAA. But so I was kind of involved in SFAA and was
00:28:00observing some of these things happening, and at the same time--'cause I was in the ASW, and I also had the anthropological site at Washington, and I also was an officer there, and the ASW could--it was a local organization, and they could no longer stay as an independent local organization within the AAA. So I saw this from two different organizations, and it was, um--there was--you can imagine--I mean, this caused some stress and strain.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And I know a little bit more clearly from ASW, it was extremely
difficult for them to then handle their own finances, and to continue to publish a volume every year--RYLKO-BAUER: Mm, yeah.
BENNETT: --and that sort of thing.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: But they, they persevered.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: But, um--and I'm--and so that meant the AAA, uh, no longer had really a
clear presence of applied anthropology within the AAA, so--RYLKO-BAUER: And this was at a time when it was really necessary.
BENNETT: Right, that's right, yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah.
BENNETT: Yeah. And who initiated the idea of NAPA, um, I'm not absolutely
00:29:00certain, but there was this huge meeting in which people didn't all agree with each other--(laughs).RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: I remember this hall, you know, big old hall, um, which people were
discussing how to form NAPA, and, um, that's a place that I saw Meta Baba for the first time--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and she was clearly a very, um, strong-minded and strong person--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --with ideas, and I, I was impressed.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And so--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --um, so it was--the--that meant that NAPA, as it, uh, uh, uh, grew in
membership and--I, I sh--it had a pretty significant membership from the beginning--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --if I remember correctly. But, um, as it expanded its accomplishments
00:30:00and what it took on--'cause it took on workshops, it took on, um, just all kinds of--I mean, it was a real presence from the relatively early on at the AAA meetings--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and has, of course, continued that way ever since.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: But, um, but that meant that we had the Society for Applied
Anthropology meetings, and then we had--RYLKO-BAUER: Right.
BENNETT: --NAPA within the AAA, and--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and then we had local practition organizations, and so things, I
guess you can say, starting in the six, seventies, and then especially picking up steam in the eighties, we get this, um, more complicated and, uh, more varied terrain when it comes to--RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah.
BENNETT: --organizations--
RYLKO-BAUER: A multi kind of level--
BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --landscape--
BENNETT: Right.
RYLKO-BAUER: --of applied anthropology.
BENNETT: Yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah.
BENNETT: Something maybe is appropriate to mention here is that, uh, this
separation of SfAA from the AAA wasn't a happy one for all people. 00:31:00RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And, um, especially in my general generation, um, the--there was--some
people, um, I think developed a loyalty to the SfAA, and some of an--somewhat of an--not--I won't say animosity, but, uh, not happiness with the AAA.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm, um-hm.
BENNETT: And I think some of those sentiments still exist.
RYLKO-BAUER: Hm.
BENNETT: But for some reason, that is not the direction I ever took.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: So--
RYLKO-BAUER: (laughs) Well, when you--so you were really kind of involved in
NAPA. I mean, you, you must have joined NAPA?BENNETT: Yes, uh-huh.
RYLKO-BAUER: I know I certainly joined both.
BENNETT: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: I was, at that time--
BENNETT: Oh, yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: --still working on my PhD, and--
BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --and, um, so really just a--well, I guess it was about nine years
later you became president. Did you have some, uh, uh, positions, um, uh, like 00:32:00on the board or something?BENNETT: Yes. I was on the board, and I did the, uh, the, uh, NAPA bulletin on LPOs.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: Meta Baba was president, and she--I, I can't remember whether I was
asked to run for the board or what.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: Um, but, but then when I got that, she made it clear that that's what
she wanted me to do in my position, was perfect for me to do--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --um, and, uh, pulled--you know, I did, um, telephone interviews--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --with a lot of people--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --to, to do that bulletin, and it was really interesting.
RYLKO-BAUER: How many--by that time, how many LPOs had developed? Because when
you were at, at WAPA, uh, it was just that that, that form--BENNETT: Yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: --of--
BENNETT: Yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: --of, um, organization was just evolving.
BENNETT: It was. There were--and, and you caught me, 'cause I, uh--I don't
remember how many there were, but we--what we did was we also, uh, included, 00:33:00like, the Arizona group--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --that was--had gone out of existence, and, um, and we must've had ten
to twelve at the time--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --that were mostly smaller than WAPA--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --but, you know, providing a needed niche, sort of following maybe not
precisely what WAPA had done, but as a, as an opportunity for people to gather together regularly--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --in that there was one sou-, southern, uh, California, SCAAN--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and there was one in New York City. There was one in Chicago. There
was one in the Philadelphia area, and, you know, and some other smatterings here.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: Oh, and, uh, the, the Plains group, and--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --you know.
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah. That--and that's a very active one.
BENNETT: Yes.
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah.
BENNETT: Yes, really.
RYLKO-BAUER: Well, you were in Memphis at the time.
BENNETT: Yes, yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: Was there one for that region?
BENNETT: Yes. There was one called MSAPA. (both laugh) And--
RYLKO-BAUER: The acronyms are, are funny for some of them.
00:34:00BENNETT: Mid-South Association--
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah.
BENNETT: --I can't remember if it--they went with--
RYLKO-BAUER: Praction--
BENNETT: --professional or--
RYLKO-BAUER: Oh.
BENNETT: --practicing anthropologist.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: That was a somewhat subtle distinction.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: Um, when I got there, I think one had just been formed, and it was,
uh--I, I think this was a wise decision--the academics in the department, the professors in the department, uh, encouraged alumni to consider doing this--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --but tried to stay out of it.
RYLKO-BAUER: Hm.
BENNETT: You know, we were s-, uh, we were--we would go to meetings or anything
like that, but, but not to be the leaders of--RYLKO-BAUER: A formal sponsor or something--
BENNETT: Yeah, right, yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: --for--yeah.
BENNETT: And, and MSAPA existed pretty strongly through the time we held the
m--the first meeting in Memphis--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --in ninety-, uh, '92.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And, uh, and then, after that, it, it sort of dissipated a bit. And it
comes and goes. There's--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --it's probably going to be reformed again now.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: Yes, Memphis had, had one.
00:35:00RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm. What, um--so when you became president, what were the k--you
know, some of the key issues? Because by then, I mean, NAPA had evolved. They, they had the--a bulletin. They--BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --were doing, you know, all kinds of workshops. They were working
toward, uh, I'm sure, professional development and things like that, so--BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --kind of where in the evolution of, of that practitioner
organization--you know, when you stepped in, where were they? And, and what did you see as the issues that really, you know, interested you?BENNETT: Well, uh, the big thing that got done during my tenure as
president--and half of which I spent at--in Geneva, at WHO, the--um, and that was pre-email.RYLKO-BAUER: Mm.
BENNETT: People in the Fed--the Feds were using email, but beyond that, there
was very little email, and nobody in the, um, mental health division at the WHO--only one person had email. So we used telephones and faxes a lot. 00:36:00(Rylko-Bauer laughs) But the big thing that got done, um, as I remember, uh, was that the, uh, careers in anthropology, uh, video was done.RYLKO-BAUER: Oh, yes, uh-huh, with Elizabeth--
BENNETT: Elizabeth Briody.
RYLKO-BAUER: --Briody, yeah.
BENNETT: Yeah, yeah, yes. And, uh, so that was--it--today it might not--today
people might wonder why was this such a big deal thing. It was a really big deal thing. First of all, Elizabeth and, um, and her, her group raised the money, uh, probably mostly from, from members who contributed money to actually physically do the video, including taking, you know--doing the video physically, but also making the video.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And, uh, and it's--I don't know--have you watched it?
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah, I have a--
BENNETT: Yes.
RYLKO-BAUER: --copy of it.
BENNETT: Yeah, yes. It's fun to watch now. (laughs)
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah, yeah.
BENNETT: It was fun then to watch, but it's--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --really fun to watch now. And, uh, and we had also a booklet that went
00:37:00along with it.RYLKO-BAUER: Yes, I remember that.
BENNETT: Yeah, yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: But getting it published, uh--this was a NAPA effort. Conceptualized,
done, and paid for by NAPA.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: When it came time to get it published, in order to publish anything,
because NAPA was a unit within the AAA, it had to get the agreement of the executive board of the AAA, because--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --it was going to be a AAA publication.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And, uh, that was, uh--I--because I was president--uh, the way AAA was
structured then--it's structured totally differently now--um, I had a seat on the executive board automatically--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --because I was the NAPA president. And I remember, it was touch-and-go
whether the vote was going to be in favor of publishing, uh, publishing--RYLKO-BAUER: Really?
BENNETT: Yes.
RYLKO-BAUER: And what were the reasons, um, against it?
BENNETT: Uh, I think the--(sighs)--I don't know that they were well articulated.
00:38:00It was that they had never done anything like this before.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And it was an innovative idea--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --uh, that, of course, emphasized the, the wide array of jobs that
anthropologists are holding--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --across the country, were holding then, and--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --still holding now. And so it just had, like, totally different theme
for any--and--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and the format was totally different.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: So there was just this, this discomfort, because it was outside of the normal--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --zone of, of AAA.
RYLKO-BAUER: It wasn't a journal. (laughs)
BENNETT: Right. No, yes, wasn't. But, uh, I will--Jim Peacock was, was ch--uh,
was, uh, president at that time. And I've always had a lot of respect for Jim Peacock, going way back, but his, uh, support of that, you know, was extremely important.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm, um-hm. Interesting.
00:39:00BENNETT: It's unbelievable, (laughs) I mean, that, that they, they could've
maybe not had that published. (laughs) It's like--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: So--
RYLKO-BAUER: Well, I think it's hard to change, and--
BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --and maybe it, you know--I mean, perhaps--do you think that, uh,
some people kind of were threatened by that, or somehow felt that the, uh, the AAA--it, it, it, it somehow would tarnish their academic image--BENNETT: Y--
RYLKO-BAUER: --in the sense of, you know, that it was a different format and
things like that?BENNETT: It probably was, but I don't remember hearing it articulated.
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah, um-hm.
BENNETT: Um, and I, I think that that--I mean, here was this new whatever we
were called then, NAPA, as a unit, sort of up-and-coming kind of unit--RYLKO-BAUER: Upstarts. (both laugh)
BENNETT: --yes, yes, yes, upstarts, absolutely--um, you know, taking that huge
step, and doing it on their own, and it wasn't--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --like the AAA had envisioned this and--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and gone after it.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: It was like, we did it, and that means Elizabeth and her--
00:40:00RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --close-knit group did it.
RYLKO-BAUER: Did that somehow open a, a, uh, the door more within the AAA--
BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --to, you know, um, uh, kind of viewing, you know, the applied, um,
and practicing anthropologists in a different way, or the roles? I mean, what, what was the consequence of that step?BENNETT: Well, I think because it, it did very well, and I think people had a
very positive reaction to it--it was used in classrooms and things like that--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --uh, I think that was a precursor to, like, what--all this material
you see on the AAA website now--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --like careers, you know, this--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: It, it made it clear that--I think it made it clear that not only was
this a legitimate thing to be doing, but it was a necessary--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: kind of thing to be doing--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --um--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --to, to continue to advance the discipline.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm, um-hm. Um, any other things that occurred during your tenure
00:41:00that you remember, uh, or, uh--BENNETT: Yes.
RYLKO-BAUER: --some initiative that you especially, you know, were involved in?
BENNETT: I know the workshops continued, um--uh, I, I can't remember, to be
honest, what--when we started the mentoring program.RYLKO-BAUER: Oh, okay.
BENNETT: Ed Lebow and others--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and Mickey Iris--
RYLKO-BAUER: Right, yeah.
BENNETT: --yeah, were involved in, um--I don't remember precisely what year we
started what, but that--RYLKO-BAUER: But that was during your--
BENNETT: Yes.
RYLKO-BAUER: --uh, time as president that had started?
BENNETT: I, I'm not sure--
RYLKO-BAUER: Oh, you're not sure.
BENNETT: --because I'm not sure when they started that.
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah, um-hm, um-hm.
BENNETT: 'Cause, uh, because I was so involved over quite a few years, and I don't--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --remember precisely what happened which year.
RYLKO-BAUER: Right, right.
BENNETT: But we did have the tenth anniversary, 'cause I remember coming back
from Geneva for that, the AAA meeting. We had the tenth anniversary of NAPA.RYLKO-BAUER: Okay.
BENNETT: We had a big, uh, reception, and--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --um, I have--in fact, I still have at home the, the s--the signature
00:42:00book, you know--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --for that.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm. And what was--by that time, what was the relationship of
NAPA vis--vis the SfAABENNETT: They pretty much operated independently--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --uh, and I'm--and, and I don't remember, you know, what evolved over
time, but I can't tell you precisely when it started was that ordinarily, um, NAPA would, at SfAA meetings, have a business meeting there--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and they'd have a present at--presence at SfAA--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and, uh--
RYLKO-BAUER: With sessions and--
BENNETT: Yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: --things like that.
BENNETT: Uh, no, not so much sessions as, uh, they would have their--
RYLKO-BAUER: Oh.
BENNETT: --business meeting.
RYLKO-BAUER: Okay.
BENNETT: Yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: SfAAm-hm.
BENNETT: Um, I don't--I don't--I don't remember if NAPA's ever--they may have,
but I don't remember.RYLKO-BAUER: Oh, you--well, yeah, I mean, when I think about--there's such an
overlapping membership. 00:43:00BENNETT: Yes, there's definitely, yes.
RYLKO-BAUER: Yes, yes. Yeah.
BENNETT: Yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: But, but NAPA--
BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --has some--
BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --um--right, it's, it's more like the Society for Medical
Anthropology and several others that sometimes link--BENNETT: They--
RYLKO-BAUER: --with them, yeah.
BENNETT: Yes, yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah.
BENNETT: Explicitly.
RYLKO-BAUER: Right, co--
BENNETT: SAE--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --uh, has done that, too, with--
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah.
BENNETT: --with, with SFAA.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm, yeah.
BENNETT: Yeah. But my impression was, uh, they went, they went in parallel, but
pretty distinct, directions.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And then what you have is a lot of overlapping memberships--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and, to some extent, overlapping leadership--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --people who are active--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --in both--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --like Shirley's been active in both. A lot of people have been active
in both.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm. Well, that's kind of a nice -
BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --segue into, um, the next, uh, you know, uh, think that I was
hoping you could talk about, because you obviously also were very--BENNETT: Yeah, yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: --much involved in both, and, and eventually became president of
00:44:00the SfAA--BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --from 1998 to 2001. Um, but in the proc--I mean, during that time
period, then, from, let's say, '94 to '98, um, you know, you were involved at the SfAA at the same time as you were involved in NAPA, um--BENNETT: Oh, going way back before that.
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah. Okay.
BENNETT: I've been going to SfAA meetings since, uh, the mid to late seventies.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And then at a certain point--I don't remember if I--I cannot remember.
I used to have--I had--I mean, some of the--well, this is kind of an aside, but one of the things I heard from people a lot who went to both SfAA and AAA meetings was, um, one of the reasons--the motivation to continue to do both was AAA was extremely important, but the SfAA meetings were a lot more enjoyable-- 00:45:00RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and a lot more manageable, and--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --a lot better to bring students into the meeting.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And so people who could possibly afford to go to both--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and wanted to go to both would do that, but they were different, very
different experiences.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And they continue to be--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --rather different experiences with--in my mind.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: Uh, and as people talk about them.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: So I was pretty active in organizing sessions for the SfAAs, along with
the AAA, and I can't remember if I had any leadership role in SfAA other than that.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: Uh, when I was asked by, uh, Tom Graves, um, Greaves, uh, who was president--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --I think when we met in York, he w--I think he was president at that
time. And, uh, he asked me to be the program chair for the '92 meetings.RYLKO-BAUER: Okay, um-hm.
BENNETT: And as you know, that's, that's a big job--
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah.
BENNETT: --in my depa--it was good for the department, but it was also a big job
00:46:00for the department.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And, and that, I think, definitely solidified my, uh, commitment to the SfAA--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --but not meaning I didn't have commitment to the AAA. It just was, was different--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --from--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And then, uh, right after that I was asked to run for the executive board--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --SfA, and I did do that, and, uh, that pulled me in to--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --eventually I was asked to, to run for the presidency.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: Which I did do.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm. Well, you--just to backtrack for a moment, you mentioned
that, um, NAPA and SfAA were, you know, starting in, let's say we're talking in the, um, nineties and, uh, you know, toward the end of the century. They were kind of parallel, but, but very--but different in a number of ways. And I think--BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --I thought that's kind of an interesting--you know, if you could
elaborate on--BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --in what ways were they different. 'Cause we can think easily how
they're similar, starting from overlapping membership, but, um, in their functioning-- 00:47:00BENNETT: Uh--
RYLKO-BAUER: --in the goals that they set or the mission that they had?
BENNETT: Well, uh, I think it's--the SfAA was an independent--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --organization, and NAPA was a part of--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --the AAA, and that just flavored everything.
RYLKO-BAUER: Hm.
BENNETT: I mean, uh--and that's--I'm saying that there--that NAPA is just part
of this bigger enterprise--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and so that has a lot of positives to it.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: But, uh, but both organ--it's really interesting; both
organizations--and I'm thinking--I think NAPA leadership--I just remember going to these extremely lengthy board members for NAPA. It was the same way with SfAA, extremely lengthy board meetings. But there's a sense of mission that, 00:48:00that NAPA had, you know, and also, for a long time I think a fair number of people really felt like we're, we're, we're doing what really needs to get done, but not getting necessarily the respect that we should be getting.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And, um, which in some ways becomes even more motivation for--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --drive to have a presence--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and to do things really well.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And to do things differently than what other people were doing in the AAA.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm. Yeah, and I can see that, um, within the AAA, I mean, you've
got the American Anthropologist. Well--BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --what role does, you know, um, uh, do practitioners play in that?
BENNETT: Um-hm, right, yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah, and things like that, which I know over time has evolved. But
that must've been--so there must've been a number of, you know, structures like that, that where--BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --you know--there probably was a feeling that--
00:49:00BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --that the, um, applied and practicing anthropologists within the
AAA didn't quite have the niche that maybe legal anthropologists or medical anthropologists had, you know? Th--and they also were--BENNETT: Um-hm, um-hm, um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --obviously overlapping, because medical anthropologists also
applied, but there was--or, you know, other kinds of--BENNETT: Yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah.
BENNETT: Yeah, the medical anthropologists--oh, uh, well, another thing that is
a distinction between--when you go to SfAA meetings, even though there's always--there, there is the presence of practitioners there, and they, they've been invited in different ways, but, uh, NAPA has a much larger percent of people who are not full-time academics--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --you know, so practitioners in that sense of the word. So--
RYLKO-BAUER: So do you make that distinction in terminology? I mean, you see
applied anthropology versus practicing anthropology in what ways? 00:50:00BENNETT: Um, pract--for me, practicing anthropology has to do with one's career
trajectory more than--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --it does with what one is necessarily doing research-wise.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: That's, um--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --it's--and the--I guess I think applied anthropology as being more generic--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and encompassing both the academic and the--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --sort of practicing non--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --full--and I say non-full-time academics, because so many of them are
also doing academic work, too.RYLKO-BAUER: Right, right.
BENNETT: So--
RYLKO-BAUER: Interesting.
BENNETT: But that's just the way I kind of--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --um, look at the words in my mind.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: But I've also not been someone to be too hardcore--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --around the--
RYLKO-BAUER: Well, you can get hung up on--
BENNETT: --lingo. (laughs)
RYLKO-BAUER: --terminology.
BENNETT: Yes.
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah.
BENNETT: Yes, yeah, um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um, and miss the bigger issues. (laughs)
BENNETT: Yeah, yes.
RYLKO-BAUER: So, um, during your tenure in the SfAA, what were, you know, some
00:51:00of the key issues and--or key initiatives that you, um, were involved in?BENNETT: When I was elected I had one thing in mind to do, and it was based
upon--I mean, one major thing that I wanted to, to initiate, and it was based on s-some conversations I'd had over a long time, mainly with Erv Chambers, about how at that time we were getting more and more departments of applied anthrop--with applied anthropology in them--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and that--how it would nice to have, like, exchange of faculty, you
know, t-to basically interconnect our departments better, rather than them being, just being--or feeling like we're competing for students--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --or competing for whatever. And so, um, I decided to create what
we--sort of Erv and I came up with the term "consortium," so that's a word we used.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And, um, and fortunately, the department of anthropology--this is--I
00:52:00had moved out of the chair's position and was in the dean's office by then--the department agreed to host--this is--gee, was--I think it was in 2000--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --February of 2000--to host, um, colleagues from I think it was nine
different departments across the country with applied anthropology to come to Memphis, and they had to pay their own airline ticket, but we put them up in the hotel and, and had meals and everything for them.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And everybody came but one. One person couldn't come. But everybody
else came.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And that was the big--we spent two days in consultation with each other--
RYLKO-BAUER: Hm.
BENNETT: --about what kind of an organization might this be.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm. Do you remember who--which, uh, departments?
BENNETT: Oh, yeah. Yes. Linda was there. (laughs)
00:53:00RYLKO-BAUER: Linda Whiteford has just walked into the room.
BENNETT: Yes. Oh, I'm sorry.
WHITEFORD: I'm not really here.
BENNETT: Uh, we had American University--let's see how many I can remember.
[phone rings][Break in audio.]
RYLKO-BAUER: So that was an interesting little--
BENNETT: Yes.
RYLKO-BAUER: --(laughs)--segment, and--
BENNETT: I can't remember what we were--I can't think--
RYLKO-BAUER: We were talking about, um--
BENNETT: Oh, the--who was there.
RYLKO-BAUER: --the beginning of the consortium.
BENNETT: Yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: And who was there?
BENNETT: Okay. John van Willigen was there.
RYLKO-BAUER: From the University of Kentucky.
BENNETT: Yes, University of Kentucky. Um, Linda Whiteford was there from
University of South Florida. Erv Chambers was there from University of Maryland. Uh, Bill Leap was there from American University. Uh, let's see--Bob Harmon was there from Long Beach. And Meta Baba was there from Wayne State. 00:54:00RYLKO-BAUER: Meta Baba was there from Wayne State.
BENNETT: Yes, from Wayne State. And, uh, I may be missing one or two--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --other people, but it was--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: There were eight other--uh, Bob Trotter was invited from Northern
Arizona, but he couldn't come.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm. So what, um, what was the end result of that meeting?
BENNETT: Well, we decided it was a good idea, and we formed ourselves, and we,
uh, over the next--we had a, uh, meeting. That's one thing about, uh, the consortium is that we frequently had meetings at both SfAA and the AAA, and one the critical aspects is that the consortium was formed as an independent organization that--RYLKO-BAUER: Oh.
BENNETT: --had strong ties--uh, we, we had most of our meetings at the SfAA meetings--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --but we also have had meetings at, at the AAA meetings.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: But made a point to be independent as an organization.
RYLKO-BAUER: And, and why was that?
BENNETT: That just seemed to be the way to go.
00:55:00RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm, um-hm.
BENNETT: Because, uh--and, and it's never created any, any problems.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm, um-hm.
BENNETT: Because we've always gotten good cooperation from the SfAA and, and,
uh, a major thing that the consortium's done over the years has been to organize sessions--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --um, on things such as tenure and promotion--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --for applied anthropologists, but lots of different sessions. And it's
one of our, one of our claims to fame.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: But in the first year, one of the big accomplishments was to decide on
our name.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And, uh, so we, after batting around a lot of different possibilities,
we, we decided on the Consortium of Applied and Practicing Anthropology Programs, and then we called that COPAA, two A's--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and, uh, it stuck.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm, um-hm.
BENNETT: We have another website. That was, that was another big development
over the early years. We used to do a web--we do a nice website. 00:56:00RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And, um, we have--in the SfAA newsletter, we have always updates on
what's going on.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm. Um-hm. And that's why I thought maybe there was a link, but,
um, but you have regular kind of summaries or kind of news items in the newsletter, right?BENNETT: Yes.
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah.
BENNETT: In the SfAA newsletter, yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm, yeah.
BENNETT: There's, uh, an implicit li-, link, but we've always been--
RYLKO-BAUER: Right.
BENNETT: --independent.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm, um-hm. Um, so i-, initially it was to kind of network and to
compare programs and maybe learn from each other and perhaps support each other, but, um, what else--obviously, it's come a long way, 'cause--and you were chair from 2000 to, um--BENNETT: Two thousand ten.
RYLKO-BAUER: --2010, yeah.
BENNETT: Yeah. Um, it's come a long ways in a lot of ways, like, uh, I would say
00:57:00especially through holding several sessions in the area of tenure and promotion, but with different f-focuses.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: Um, we then, as the AAA--and this is where it gets really com--the
whole thing gets organizationally sort of more complex--is the AAA then, um, formed the, uh, Practicing Anthropology Working Group, and then the COPAPIA, which is the Committee On Practicing Applied and Public Interest Anthropology--uh, COPAA, who had--which was an organization that had some history by that time, started to collaborate with this AAA org--committee, especially in the area of tenure and promotion guidelines for, um, for anthropologists in--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --departments, and that's one of the recent initiatives that we worked
00:58:00on together, so--and, like, the employer expo that's going on right now, um, COPAA is a cosponsor, mainly because we give a contribution--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --to the reception at the end of that--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --of the expo, along with COPAPIA, the AAA committee.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: So this is a sign--it's not, like, uh, are we constantly doing projects together--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --but there are some key things that we, uh--that COPAA has, has
continued to connect with other organizations, while retaining its autonomy.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm, um-hm.
BENNETT: Um, and it's, you know, expanded from those initial nine departments to twenty-seven--
RYLKO-BAUER: Okay.
BENNETT: --departments now.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm. Well, it sounds like--it--I mean, will--it sounds like
there, there was a kind of a, a gap, maybe, in terms of, um, really concrete strategies for the continual professionalization of, of anthropology, in, uh--of 00:59:00applied anthropologists, I mean--in the sense of, uh, your mentioning, you know, uh, tenure cre--I mean, how do people who do applied work but in, are in academic settings, is--BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --how they--what they needed to do, and how the departments needed
to view the work that they did.BENNETT: Yes.
RYLKO-BAUER: I mean, was that part of--
BENNETT: That's actually very much part of it, because one of the, um--one of
the goals of the, the member departments--and I think that's, um--that makes us a little bit distinct from other--(laughs)--organizations in that the members of COPAA are departments of anthropology that have a commitment to applied and practicing anthropology--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and for educating students, practitioners, and faculty members is the
idea. So the basic thrust of it is how we as a group can learn from each other to do a better job at educating our students to go into the discipline in a more 01:00:00open-minded kind of way.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And so we initially started to address that through sessions at
meetings, but we now have this--the visitors program that is a competition every year for a department to apply for support from COPAA to have a visitor come in to the department to help--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --you know, so called educate the students--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and, and again, it's like, you know, just, just a strong ethic of
cross-pollina--pollinization of ideas, rather than-- I mean, I remember taking a strong position when the--my department agreed to do this, contrary, contrary to another faculty member, who basically said, "Well, don't we want to keep our students here?" And I just said, you know, "If this is not the best program for them, (laughs) that is not what we should be doing. We really need to know." And 01:01:00I feel very strongly about that, that, that--and through COPAA I think we know a lot more about what different departments do, and do really well.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And so that if students are really interested in certain kind of
applied, uh, practicing anthropology, um, and if they can do it, then they can consider going--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --to the appr-, you know, the right department.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And I think as a collective group we have come to know a lot more about
the strengths of each other--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --you know.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm. Um, it--what about, um, uh, curriculum development? Has
there been--uh, uh, uh, was tha-, is that an area the--uh, of interest, or--BENNETT: --------(??)--
RYLKO-BAUER: --is it even, uh, an area that needs work?
BENNETT: Um, I think there's been exchanges of ideas around that--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and they may be--since I moved out of, uh, the leadership, they may
be working in curriculum development, but--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --it doesn't ring a bell.
01:02:00RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: Um--
RYLKO-BAUER: What--
BENNETT: --I know AAA from time to time has done curriculum development--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --um, activities.
RYLKO-BAUER: Well, and I'm thinking also of, you know--I mean, you have the
applied programs, but then you have all kinds of other graduate programs where students, you know, end up finishing the program, either at the masters or the PhD level--BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --go out onto the job market, and other becau-, from the beginning
decide that they aren't going to be in academic, or, you know, because of the, um, uh, you know, the fact that the, the jobs aren't--BENNETT: Right.
RYLKO-BAUER: --as, as, as plentiful as they used to be, end up looking for
elsewhere. So this--I mean, I don't know where this issue is of how you train students for, you know, what's really the reality of the job market in nonapplied programs, and is that an issue that's come under discussion?BENNETT: I'm sure. Yeah, it's definitely an issue, and--because we have a hard
01:03:00enough time to do it in programs that--(laughs)--are committed to doing it.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm, um-hm.
BENNETT: Yeah. And I know, uh, curriculum development is, is probably something
really worth focusing on, and especially that that deals with internships and practicums and things like that.RYLKO-BAUER: Mm, um-hm, um-hm. So, um, are you still involved in with COPAPIA,
or, or CO-, uh, COPAA?BENNETT: Uh, I am. They keep me on their listserv, and so--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --I get, um, I get--and I go to their business meeting every year.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: Yeah, I definitely am involved, but--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --when(??)--
RYLKO-BAUER: 'Cause you were--I know you were also, just for the record, um,
from 2007 to 2009 you were the chair of COPAPIA.BENNETT: Yes, I was, yes.
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah, um-hm.
BENNETT: From 2010--
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah.
BENNETT: Yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: So there was kind of overlap time--
BENNETT: There was, yeah.
01:04:00RYLKO-BAUER: --with when you were in the leadership position in both of these.
BENNETT: Yes, and--
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah.
BENNETT: --I had done three years of PAWG chairship before that, which--
RYLKO-BAUER: Three years of what?
BENNETT: PAWG, the Practicing Anthropology Working Group--
RYLKO-BAUER: Oh, okay.
BENNETT: --of the AAA--
RYLKO-BAUER: Okay.
BENNETT: --and that was the precursor to--
RYLKO-BAUER: To--
BENNETT: --COPAPIA.
RYLKO-BAUER: Okay, um-hm.
BENNETT: And that was a--uh, that was a very labor-intensive and really
interesting experience, because we did--we did research, um, to feed back to the AAA executive board about kind of the status of things in terms of, of where people had careers--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --outside of academia--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --by doing interviews. We did a lot of telephone interviews, and then--
RYLKO-BAUER: Mm, um-hm.
BENNETT: --wrote up, you know, summaries of all those, and gave
these--(laughs)--I mean, I, I don't know I ever have done, uh, as a group done so many reports. (laughs) Tony Paredes used to come to Memphis. Well, he--uh, his wife worked at the University of Memphis for a while. He used to come, and 01:05:00we would sit down and spend the full day working on a report for PAWG. He was on the PAWG group.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And then we recommended that a standing committee be formed--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --which they did do--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --with COPAPIA.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: So, uh--which I chaired for a couple years, and--
RYLKO-BAUER: Well, what is the relationship between NAPA and COPAPIA?
BENNETT: Um, COPAPIA's a committee, NAPA is a section--
RYLKO-BAUER: Right.
BENNETT: --within the AAA. The--we've always had from the beginning of COPAPIA,
like, I can't tell you for sure how many past presidents--RYLKO-BAUER: (laughs) Okay.
BENNETT: --of NAPA--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --who served on COPAPIA.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: But it's a real--it was, uh--we recommended from PAWG, and they
followed through on having representation from different parts of applied anthropology, practicing anthropology--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --um, on COPAPIA, like museums, archeology--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --make sure it was not just a s-, a sociocultural group.
RYLKO-BAUER: Right.
BENNETT: And, and, and, uh, business and--
01:06:00RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --you know, so it's been a really eclectic group of people.
RYLKO-BAUER: And, and, um, who fits into the public interest part of that title?
BENNETT: I think in some ways everybody does. (laughs) Uh, we were given--that
probably wasn't the title we asked to be called, but we were pretty much--because it, um, it's--I think it has something to do with the political landscape--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --you know, that--you asked me earlier about applied and practicing and
you had, but then other people were using the term "public interest."RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And so I think when the decision was made to form the group to be inclusive--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and that language is now being used in the AA, you know, too.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: Um--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --so I, I, I think it's just an attempt to be inclusive.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm. Well, is there anything else about, uh, all these
01:07:00different--you know, the, the progression of your involvement in these different organizations that you--that come to mind, or, um--?BENNETT: Well, um, a few years ago I remember coming to one of the--I think it
was an SfAA meeting, and somebody asking me, whom I hadn't met before, uh, you know, what I was doing, and I said something like, um, uh, in my job and also in my leadership work, at that time, uh, find myself trying to get an eclectic group of people to work together collaboratively, or cooperatively.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And mostly through facilitation style--(laughs)--you could say.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: But, but to be trying to, um--and, and something in--that changed when
01:08:00I started to do PAWG and COPAPIA was that our meetings were entirely through conference calls--RYLKO-BAUER: Hm.
BENNETT: --which is a very different dynamic--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --from any than I'd ever, uh, used before as, like, your main modality of--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --of making decisions and getting things done.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And s--and that makes it--that adds a different--very interesting, but--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --a different process of--uh, way of going about doing it.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: But I do--I--I do this because, um, in my job as a, uh, as associate
dean for graduate programs in a big college, I try to do that with all of my graduate coordinators from all the departments, and it's--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --uh, it's, of course, sometimes like pulling teeth--(laughs)--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm, um-hm.
BENNETT: --or whatever.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: But, but it is my--kind of the way in which I like to operate.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: Um, and to try to get, get, um, good collective work done. But it's
01:09:00more--it's, it's definitely more pronounced in trying to, um, to accomplish things through an org--a, a voluntary organization.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm. Well, it does sound like, um, you know, collaboration is--
BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --one of the strong themes throughout your--
BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --both your research, your, you know, your academic, uh, work, and,
um, in, uh, your, you know, involvement in, in all these different leadership positions--BENNETT: Yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: --so that's kind of interesting, yeah.
BENNETT: And it has, it has made all the difference in my being able to work in
former Yugoslavia--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --was to be able--
RYLKO-BAUER: Right.
BENNETT: --to do that.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm. Well, you mentioned, um, that you're now the associate dean
at the University of Memphis, so maybe that's a nice, you know, way of, of kind of talking for just a couple minutes about--BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --you know, uh, your, um, uh, arrival at the University of Memphis,
01:10:00and, you know, what the department was like in relationship to applied anthropology, and, you know, what role you've played there, and how it's, um, you know--relates to the development of other departments over time in other universities.BENNETT: I'm actually glad we're having a chance to talk about that, because
I'm, uh--I was interested in the position at the University of Memphis because, like you said earlier, um, there weren't a lot of applied anthropology programs, and the kind of work I had done I--made me most fitting for that kind of department, rather than a more traditional department. And, uh, Stan Hyland and I are writing a chapter for a book right now that we're close to completing the chapter, um, on the history of the department as it's interacted with the wider 01:11:00community, and the community within the university, and--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --this history is, like, th--'cause we're about ready to have our
thirty-fifth anniversary.RYLKO-BAUER: Oh, um-hm.
BENNETT: And it's the hundredth anniversary of the University of Memphis. So,
um--and Stan was part of the early scene in the department. He was a, uh, educated with Dmitri Sim--Shimkin.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And, um, one of my other colleagues, Charles Williams, also was a
Shimkin student.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And they both came to U of M in the seventies, and, uh--but, but what's
kind of interesting--it was really fortunate in the, in the long run, for sure, what happened--the department--uh, anthropology was part of sociology and anthropology, with strong archaeological presence. And, uh, when the 01:12:00anthropologists decided they wanted to try to get their own department and develop a masters program, as well as an undergraduate program, the Tennessee Board of Regents said, "You can only do this if you do not duplicate any--you do not duplicate UT Knoxville," which was extremely strong in forensics and archaeology--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and still are. Um, and second, "You have to, uh--you have to address
problems in the, the mid-South community, and you have to work with students on developing careers." So--(laughs)--RYLKO-BAUER: Perfect.
BENNETT: So it was like the charge was a requirement. But in some ways, it was
like the saving grace of something like--RYLKO-BAUER: Well, it gave you a framework to start with, definitely. And one
that fit--BENNETT: Um-hm, yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: --yeah, I'm sure, yeah. Huh.
BENNETT: So that's what happened, and, and we, uh, had from--we had three
concentrations: we had urban and medical and then a public archaeology. 01:13:00RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And where now we have, um, the medical and urban. The archaeologists
have been moved to the Earth science department--RYLKO-BAUER: Mm.
BENNETT: --some years ago.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: But, um, but one of the--I mean, there's, there's, there's so much to
be said about how things evolved in the department. And I came there in '86, and very quickly I could see this myself, and it was a pretty small graduate program at that time, and, uh--but there was al-, already a legacy of graduate students graduating and taking really meaningful leadership positions in the community, and then working with our faculty in--like, as colleagues. And--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and so what's happened over the years with, uh, at least two or three
hundred alums from that masters program is that so many of them are now serving really critical roles in the mid-South community, or other places in the country, and provide, um, provide resources for us that, that we could never do 01:14:00ourselves, you know, by just faculty doing it, that provide really rich opportunities for our students, undergraduate and graduate students.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And, and it's a practicum-based program rather than a thesis-based
program. And so, um, so it's like we've ceded the mid-South community with anthropologists.RYLKO-BAUER: Interesting.
BENNETT: And, and there was this much broader recognition of what anthropology
than you'd find most places.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: It's--
RYLKO-BAUER: So is it a masters program?
BENNETT: It's a masters program.
RYLKO-BAUER: Okay.
BENNETT: Yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm. So is it--can you give an example of how this has worked,
you know, in terms of, uh, uh, you know--maybe an early example of how this--BENNETT: Okay.
RYLKO-BAUER: --started to--
BENNETT: Yes.
RYLKO-BAUER: --work, where you had the former students kind of looping back.
BENNETT: Okay. Uh, I'll mention one person in particular, Tim Bolding, who
was--I actually met-- he was a student, um, when I interviewed in 1986. And, uh, 01:15:00he was in the urban concentration, and, uh, had actually spent, spent some time in Mexico. But he was very interested in anthropology; otherwise he wouldn't be in the program. But when he graduated and went into county government, which at that time, uh, had some pretty liberal, um, components to it--it's shifted since that time, and, uh, we have some anthropologists working in county government still, but not like it was for a while. But he ended up founding an organization that was--existed for fifteen years, something like that, called United Housing. And, uh, it works with low income, uh, families who are trying to, uh, f-, get financial support, and, and to buy their, their usually first homes.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: But there's a whole--I mean, it's a very complex organization, and he,
01:16:00in turn, has had many of our students work with him in their practicums, and he has hired alums from our program. It's a very, uh, highly regarded, recognized entity in Memphis.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: Um, and, uh, and s-, and Tim is definitely, uh, w-, is seen as a close
colleague, um, to many of us.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: He teaches in our department. He teaches a night class on Tuesday night.
RYLKO-BAUER: Hm, um-hm.
BENNETT: --and, uh, we get some of our majors because of him.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm, um-hm.
BENNETT: You know, yeah, that sort of thing. And t-, uh, this is a good sign.
You know, I'm in the College of Arts and Sciences, and we have an alumni association event every fall, and recognized Friends of the College. And we've had three people in the last, I'd say, ten years get that Friend of the College 01:17:00recognition who were alums of our masters program.RYLKO-BAUER: Oh, okay.
BENNETT: Very different kinds of people, and Tim Bolding was one of them.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm, um-hm.
BENNETT: So it's, um--so when we put together an advisory board, uh, for the
department, we have a lot of people to draw from.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm, it sounds like that, yeah. Um, how many--d-, has m-, uh, the
University of Memphis been served at all as a model for other departments that, you know, developed applied programs? That, that you might know of?BENNETT: That's a good question, and, uh, it's hard to --------(??)--
RYLKO-BAUER: You know, that's one of the earliest ones.
BENNETT: Well, yeah. Come to think of it, like, I remember Bob Harmon came.
We've had people come to visit to talk--this is going back in time--to talk with, talk with them--talk with us about how we developed a program and how we did it, but what's happened over the years, especially one of the nice things 01:18:00about being chair of a COPAA group was that, um, if departments were interested in different parts of the country--I'm trying to think--I've just gotten so many calls over the years from a faculty member, like a chair, who wanted to put together, um, a masters program wi-, with--either was applied or with applied in it, and what kind of advice did I have. And then there issues such as curriculum come up--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --of course. And so we've been referred to, uh, by external reviewers
as, like, the Memphis model--RYLKO-BAUER: Mm.
BENNETT: --of how we do, um--
RYLKO-BAUER: Okay.
BENNETT: --our education of applied anthropologists.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm, um-hm.
BENNETT: And, and I think in--and, of course, we're always--we've got--we have,
uh--we participate in a poster session at the SFA meetings, and--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --we send, uh--most of our graduate students at one time or the other
01:19:00go to an SfAA meeting--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and we help to support them to do that.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: So there's a strong--our--the department is very strongly tied, uh, to
both the SfAA and, uh, I would say a COPAPIA and the AAA.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm, um-hm.
BENNETT: So--and, you know, uh--and Ruth Beth Finerman has been super active--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --leadership in the SMA.
RYLKO-BAUER: SMA, um-hm.
BENNETT: Um-hm, and, and--
RYLKO-BAUER: And, and the SfAA, yeah.
BENNETT: Yeah, both of them.
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah.
BENNETT: Yeah, so--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um, who are some of the, um--when you came, who were the faculty in
the department?BENNETT: Okay, uh, Tom Collins, who was a socio-cultural sort of economic
anthropologist was the chair.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And he, he had--so Tom was the chair, and he was--I think the chair,
when the department became a department, I think he was the chair. I don't know if he was immediately the chair, but early on he was. And he, uh--I think he 01:20:00brought in Stan Hyland and Charles Williams, who were--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --who worked in, in applied research.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: Um, and then Ruth Beth Finerman came the year before me, and then we
had archaeologist, uh, uh, Charles McNutt. He's our senior archaeologist, and, uh, then David Dye, who was a younger archaeologist.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And we had a couple other f-, I think we had one other faculty member
who was not part of this commitment to applied anthropology.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: Um, so it was, it was pretty small.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And then what had happened, from what Stan tells me over the years, is
that they got the urban area pretty solidified early on--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --but the medical one, people came and went, and--or didn't fit that well--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --you know, because we have always, since I've been there, and before
01:21:00me, emphasized if somebody comes into the faculty they should plan to do some work in the region.RYLKO-BAUER: Mm.
BENNETT: And--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and so you've got, you know, Ruth Beth Finerman who did, you know,
years and years of work in Ecuador before she joined our faculty the year before me, and then me with my Yugoslav work, but we both have done work in the Memphis region, too.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm, um-hm.
BENNETT: And we certainly work with students, have them do work.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: So this--you know, but for anybody who came in and are--Keri Brondo now
and Katherine Lambert-Pennington, um, have been there--I think this is her fourth year--have done phenomenal, uh, work--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --since they came, plus their international work.
RYLKO-BAUER: And is Satish Kedia there, too?
BENNETT: Yes, but he is in the School of Public Health now.
RYLKO-BAUER: Oh, okay. And Satish finished the University of Kentucky--
BENNETT: Yes, yes, yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: --which is what I--
BENNETT: Yes, yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: --where I finished, yeah.
BENNETT: Yeah, he came into anthropology and was there for, uh, several years,
01:22:00and then, uh, we were getting a school of public health--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and he was invited to join their faculty, and decided he would do that.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And that's when, uh, we, uh, had--we, we just, uh--well, that was--and
then we had to--we were down one person, so we've had to readjust to that.RYLKO-BAUER: Well, um, any other kind of concluding thoughts, or--?
BENNETT: Oh, this is really nice. I'm enjoying this very much. (laughs)
RYLKO-BAUER: Yes, well, same here. (laughs) I know you--when we were talking,
uh, earlier, before I started recording, um, you mentioned, um, just how important happenstance was, and taking advantage of, of opportunities, and, uh, maybe that would be a good way of finishing up, you know--BENNETT: Sure.
RYLKO-BAUER: --um--
BENNETT: Did I mention already about, uh, how I decided to become--uh, to go
01:23:00into graduate school anthropology?RYLKO-BAUER: No, you didn't.
BENNETT: I talked about that with you before.
RYLKO-BAUER: Yeah, you didn't, yes.
BENNETT: Yeah. But that's, that's one of the first--well, first happenstance is
I did not sign up for an anthropology course. It was assigned to me, uh, when I was in my junior year in college, my fir-- my first semester jun-- in the junior year, and, and, uh, got really, really interested in it. And so, uh, w--later that year, early my senior year, thinking about, uh, where I might--where and what I might do graduate study in, and I was thinking sociology, social work, anthropology, and, uh, my advisor, uh, suggested to me that I consider thinking about going into teaching college, which had never in my life--I never even thought of that at all. And turns out his wife was a college professor--(laughs)--so that was good. 01:24:00RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And as soon as I started thinking in those terms, I thought, if you're
going to be a college teacher, what better discipline is there than anthropology? So that's, that's what, uh, sort of sent me in that direction.RYLKO-BAUER: And why did you think that?
BENNETT: Hmm?
RYLKO-BAUER: What did you see in anthropology that you felt lent it so well to teaching?
BENNETT: Well, it, it was intrinsically just so interesting.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: That--I think that was a thing.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: Because my first course, I had combination of the archaeology, the
physical anthropology, the socio-cultural.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And it's whole--I was very intrigued by this whole new language of
terminology, and having to lew-- learn these new terms that--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --had never crossed my, um, my mind before. (laughs)
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And it was just fun. And, and then I had some archaeology experience.
I, I did a fair amount of coursework as an undergraduate.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: Uh, so it w-, it was--it was a good decision.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And then another happenstance thing that was very important--there
01:25:00was--there were many of them, but as I was writing my dissertation, or doing--I was collecting the data, and I wasn't quite writing yet, but it was time for me--I was in Washington, D.C.--it was time for me to start to think about applying for, like, faculty positions at--in various regional colleges around Washington. I was just--my mindframe--my mindset was just shifting in that direction, uh, and I got a call, uh, from the chair of the anthropology department at American, Jim Bodeen(??), and he said he had just gotten a call from a psychiatrist down at, uh, George Washington University, Steve Vaughn(??), and he was looking for an anthropologist to work with him on a project he just got funded.RYLKO-BAUER: Wow.
BENNETT: So--(both laugh)--
RYLKO-BAUER: Talk about falling into a--
BENNETT: I know. I know. And he, uh--so he gave me his number, and I called
01:26:00Steve, and went down a day or two later to be interviewed, and, uh, turns out he really wanted someone who had interviewing experience, of which I had a lot at that point, doing my dissertation research.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And I loved interviewing, so, um, he--I think he hired
me--(laughs)--without talking with anybody else at that time. And, uh, that was just, like--that was truly, uh, a great experience.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: Those twelve years at GW, working with multidisciplinary people,
but, like, really sharp people--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --you know, where nothing goes out at a center, like, grant
applications, uh, articles, and nothing goes out--nothing went out without the senior scientists reviewing things--RYLKO-BAUER: Mm.
BENNETT: --and talking about them.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: It was very--uh, very good, uh--it wasn't so much training as
01:27:00experience for me.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And it definitely--if I--I, I probably before then, I would've paid lip
service to, oh yeah, it's a good idea to work collaboratively with people from different backgrounds, and really believed it, but this was like--I just learned.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And, and I came to see how, uh, people's--it's not just their
educational backgrounds and their professional backgrounds; it's their personalities and everything.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: You get so many different kinds of contributions to, like--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --a research project.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And that was pretty--that was a pretty nifty experience. So that
fell--that pretty much fell--(laughs)--into my lap. And, uh, I've had other, uh--other things like that have happened along the way, but that was one of the more--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --notable ones.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm. Well, it seems to me that, uh, you know, we--as you said, we
talked a lot about collaboration, but I think people also recognize that it's 01:28:00difficult to do--BENNETT: Yes, it is.
RYLKO-BAUER: --and, you know--and may not even know how to start. And I think
this experience gave you, clearly, the tools for doing that, you know?BENNETT: It certainly helped me--
RYLKO-BAUER: And--
BENNETT: --yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: Well, um, should we conclude?
BENNETT: Sure.
RYLKO-BAUER: Is there any last, um--where do you see the--let's end by
this--with this last question: where do you see, from all your historical, you know, knowledge, um, experience, uh, the involvement that you've had on so many different levels in applied anthropology, where do you see this discipline, you know, going? Where are we heading in the next, let's say, ten years?BENNETT: Well, I'll tell you where--I don't know if it's going to head this way,
but I think the momentum is there, and I'm just not sure how much resistance there will be to, um, modifying the aca-- the graduate programs in anthropology, 01:29:00both at the masters and doctoral level, and, to some extent, undergraduate, as well, to, to a different mindset as to where students should start to envision, and then prepare themselves to move--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --professionally.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And that's one thing--I mean, I'm, I'm really very--you know, for
somebody who's worked in academic settings most of my life, uh, in different kinds of roles, but I have to say I'm an academician.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: But at the same time, I am really committed to this--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --partly because I've seen--uh, I've seen us do a good job at, at U of M--
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and I see other departments doing a really good job. So I think this
is--th-, there--there's that thing, that aspect that I hope the discipline 01:30:00continues to move in, but it requires moving away from a very elitist, um--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --stance on the part of quite a lot of our departments of anthropology
in terms of what are the--what are the good careers that people should be moving into--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --and what are not? So it's a, it's a mind shift. For some of us, it's
not, but for a lot of people in the discipline, it is.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: But I think we're, we're working on that.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: Is that a--? So, uh, I had a couple ideas and they've slipped my mind.
(both laugh)RYLKO-BAUER: Oh, well, I'll fill in for a second--
BENNETT: Yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: --and maybe they'll come to you, because it, it strikes me, too,
you know, just kind of following up on what you just said, that, um--BENNETT: --------(??)--
RYLKO-BAUER: Well, just that, you know, in the process of, of incorporating, um,
01:31:00some aspect of application, in regular, traditional departments, that's one way of--BENNETT: Um-hm.
RYLKO-BAUER: --operationalizing this, this concern with how anthropology can be
more relevant and more engaged.BENNETT: Right, yeah.
RYLKO-BAUER: And so maybe that's some way of, of kind of trying to get that
message across to more traditional departments, yeah.BENNETT: Yes. I think there are ways to do it, and, uh, what -- another facet of
this that I've noted briefly earlier--it has to do with--in order for, um, departments that are committed to applied anthropology, and to career development with their students that are not directed toward academic life, the, uh--it's necessary that the tenure promotion process, and what's valued for tenure promotion, be examined with that in mind.RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: And that's another thing that we, we have been working on, but I think
01:32:00that's really quite important. And, and then--and then I, I, I mentioned earlier--talking about the University of Memphis--that one aspect about the way we've gone about the Memphis model is by incorporating our alumni into--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --the, uh, the work of the department in a meaningful kind of way.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: It seemed like there was something else I was going to add. (laughs)
That's probably--RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm.
BENNETT: --plenty.
RYLKO-BAUER: Um-hm. Well, I really enjoyed talking with you, Linda.
BENNETT: Thank you very much, Barbara.
RYLKO-BAUER: You know, I've known you for a while, but I've learned a lot
more--(laughs)--and, uh, it's just really interesting to, you know, to kind of see how someone's career, you know, has evolved over time, so--BENNETT: Well, this was very enjoyable to do.
RYLKO-BAUER: So thank, thank you, on behalf of myself, and on behalf of the SfAA
01:33:00oral history project, so--BENNETT: Thank you very much.
RYLKO-BAUER: This is the end of the interview.
[End of audio file]
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