Interview with Kenny Walker, November 23, 2015

Interviewer: Alright Kenny I'm gonna have your first state your name and your hometown.

Walker: OK. Kenny Walker from Roberta, Georgia.

Interviewer: Tell me a little bit about growing up in Roberta, Georgia.

Walker: Roberta, Georgia is a small rural town. Population about twenty five hundred people, two red lights in the whole town. So everybody knows everybody. Just a down-home little country town in Georgia, about an hour and half south of Atlanta. Twenty five miles west of Macon.

Interviewer: And as you're growing up, who who introduced you to sports or in particular basketball?

Walker: OK, I've got three older older brothers. My brother Lewis is four years older than I am. Jerome is eight years older than I am. And George is nine years older than I am. So I'm the baby in my family. And they always let me know that I'm still the baby. Don't care what I've been able to do in my career, but they were very instrumental in me getting into the game of basketball because they all play and I initially getting into the game, uh I 00:01:00just wanted to be like my older brothers. So they really worked with me a lot early on in my career and they got me started.

Interviewer: Were you one of the last picks in the pickup games then and look after you?

Walker: I never got picked up in any game because I was so small. All my relatives and the neighbors, they were always playing I would always be on the side. You know, just really watching, you know, I couldn't even get the ball to the basket when I initially started to try to play at about, I guess, six or seven years old. But my mother built me a little smaller goal on the side of a utility house that we had. So I could ring it in the hole, in her words. So I guess it helped that a lot, too, in a lot of different ways, because see lowered the goal I could be able to put the ball in the basket, but I wasn't really that good initially. I only loved the game because I was 00:02:00around it so much, but I kept working at it. I really didn't blossom into a really good basketball player until I was about in the ninth grade.

Interviewer: So. So you started out dunking then with that outside basket?

Walker: No, not that like that. I remember the first time that I got my very first dunk. It was in the ninth grade like I was saying. I was, you know, not really that tall, but I kind of hit my growth spurt at that time. And it went from about, I guess, six feet to about like 6'3, 6'4 in the ninth grade. And it was the day before our first game and we were warming up of practice. And I'll never forget my high school coach was changing a light at the top of the game. He was on this long ladder. He was watching us warm up and we were always trying to dunk. And man I went through that. I missed a couple and I 00:03:00think on the third try, I finally got one and the whole gym and everybody just kind of erupted because it was the first time we all had tried to dunk and actually got one in. My high school basketball coach almost fell off the ladder I think when he saw that. But that's first time that I dunked, when I was in the ninth grade. Crawford County High School, which in Georgia, there's a class system. You go from single-A all the way up to five-A. So we're double A school and we have a lot of success in basketball because we didn't have a football program at that school at that time. So all our tradition was in basketball and a couple my older brothers came really, really close to winning our state championships. But by the time that I came along, we had some guys that were about my age and we had been playing basketball together 00:04:00since we were in the eighth and ninth grade. And man, we just developed a good chemistry and we won back to back state championships, my junior and senior year in high school. And it's a feat that they haven't been able to accomplish since we left. They came very close last year. They played in the championship game and lost in the championship game. But that was probably my greatest memory of my high school days.

Interviewer: What year did you start playing and varsity? Your freshman?

Walker: Well, I was a freshman. I was playing junior varsity. But by the end of the year, I kind of elevated my game and my coach moved me up to the varsity, which was at that time, boy, the big thing for me because I didn't get a chance to play. They moved me up to practice with the older guys. I sat on the bench, you know, for like the last, I guess 10 games of, you know, with the varsity my freshman year. And then I came back my sophomore year and that's when I was able to start and kind of develop into the player, I guess 00:05:00they'll eventually become.

Interviewer: So you won back-to-back state championships your junior and senior year. Obviously, you're starting to get some letters in the recruiting process. Tell me a little bit about who is recruiting you and how that process went for you.

Walker: Well, you should know, growing up in Indiana, it's just like when you're home state kid, and everybody's recruiting you,e verybody wants to stay home. And that was a really tough decision for me because Georgia was only about maybe two hours north, I guess, northeast of where, I where I live. So a lot of my family and friends went to the University of Georgia, course. Georgia football, Herschel Walker, at the height of their popularity when I was coming out of high school. Now, had I playing football. I probably would have been an easy decision to go to Georgia. But it was basketball. And I was being 00:06:00recruited by North Carolina, Georgia Tech, Maryland, Pittsburgh, Minnesota. And, you know, to have that type of recognition and be in that little, small town that had never happened before. So it was a big decision because everywhere I went, I really had fun. But obviously, when you come to the University of Kentucky and you see the history and tradition of this basketball program, it's unlike anything I had ever seen before. So, the biggest thing for me was could I rise up to the challenge and feel like I actually belong at a place like UK. But there was a lot of pressure from the hometown people and fans to go to University of Georgia and actually Auburn was right there because Chuck Person and I was being recruited by Auburn, who had Charles Barkley, who is only a year older than we are. And Charles tried to convince me that, "Hey, Kenny, I 00:07:00can get you and Chuck, we can dethrone Kentucky and the SCC and we can win this thing." And I was like, well, Boogie and Turpin was a little bit more attractive, you know. And, you know, kind of an ironic situation, you know, throughout my career at Kentucky, Barkley was good. Chuck was good. We met in the SCC tournament. You know, later on in my career and arguably the probably the biggest moment of my basketball career maybe came against Charles Barkley.

Interviewer: Now, did you make going back to high school? Were you like McCall's all American getting awards like that?

Walker: Yeah, I was a parade all-American lit, (??) was all American. I was considered, at the time, the second best forward in the country. But behind a guy named Billy Thompson, who eventually went to the University of Louisville and kind of had a rivalry with him, ever since high school. And Billy was the 00:08:00number, considered a lot of people, the number one player in the country that year. And he was like 6'8, big hands like Dr. Jake, run and jump. He could do everything that I could do itself for. He was a little bit more bigger, had a little bit better body. You know, I thought and of course, he went to Louisville and I came to the UK in our rivalry, not only started in high school, but it went four years of college. And I guess you can say he, in the end, I guess he got the ultimate prize over me because they won the championship, I guess, in 1986.

Interviewer: How much did you know about Kentucky and Kentucky basketball when you're coming out high school before all this recruiting process started?

Walker: Not a lot. I'm very thankful for my coach, high school basketball coach Clyde Zachary. When Kentucky called and I got a letter from Kentucky. 00:09:00Kenny, he called me in his office at the school and he said, "Oh, you got a letter and a call from the Kentucky people. They want to come down and see you." And I was like, "Oh, okay." You know. He's like, "No! You don't understand. This is the University of Kentucky, you know, calling." He could tell by my reaction I had no idea because I really was into college basketball at that time. So I remember him getting me a book, you know, to read about the history of Kentucky basketball. And then you go back to all the way that Adolph Rupp in the championships in how we've been good from one decade and all of the great players that Kentucky get. I mean, it really peaked my curiosity from the standpoint that, again, do I belong? Can a little small town guy go into 00:10:00that type of situation in accept that challenge andand think that I can do it? And I have to give Jobie Hall and Lynard Hamilton. I guess Lynard Hamilton was Coach Charles's lead recruiter, when they finally set up this meeting for me to come to Kentucky, I remember a lot of things that Coach Hall said to me during that recruiting trip that eventually came true. He was brutally honest with me in terms of my ability and talent. He said, "Son, you can go into any school anywhere and be a great basketball player." He's said "I'm gonna give you that." He said, "But what sets Kentucky apart is our history and tradition, not only competing for championships and developing players, but it's the things that can happen in your life after basketball is done. If you go to school, get your degree, keep your nose clean, even if you don't play in 00:11:00the NBA, you can have a life in Kentucky where you're going to have the connections after your career is over with if you do the things that that you're supposed to do." And of course, when he left, me, my mom and dad, we kind of laughed. Said "Man, that guy right there was really trying to set a program saying that, you know, people are going to respond to you 25 and 30 years after you've left the University of Kentucky." But course, today I'm a living witness that all the things that have happened in my life before Kentucky after the UK, I would say that decision changed my life forever because the report that I have with the fans and the people that I've met throughout my career, I think that's most important thing to me.

Interviewer: How do you describe the fans of Kentucky basketball?

Walker: Kinda like I guess Calipari said, they're crazy. They're 00:12:00they're nuts. But in a good way. In a good way, because we Kentucky fans will win at everything. And it's an enormous amount of pressure to play here. They wanna be number one when the season starts. They want to be number one in the season over. They want to be number one in recruiting. They want to have the most fans at the NCAA tournament games. They want to have the most tweets of any college team out there. So that's that's what you're dealing with. It takes a very special person and personality, I think, to play at Kentucky, because, you know, all of this pressure and high expectations, you know that you're going to get this when you come here. And I think that it takes a very special person to be able to deal well while 00:13:00other people will call distractions and outside influences that comes along with this. Which amazes me to this day that, you know, Calipari's been able to what he's been able to do in this short period time.

Interviewer: When did you understand that? Did you understand that before you came university or what year or how long into your career did you understand?

Walker: I think probably for me somewhere, maybe midway during my freshman year. I mean, even through the whole recruiting process, you think that you have an idea, you know, just from a recruiting visit, but it takes more than that. You have to be around this program every day for 365 days, for a couple years sometimes, to really appreciate that. Every day that you walk out your dorm, whether it's going to class, going to the convenience store or the bookstore 00:14:00or wherever, the grocery store, the car wash. You've got people that's constantly talking Kentucky basketball. They want to know your opinion. They feel like you've been on the inside and you've got the scoop or whatever is going on. But it's it's fun. But you got to embrace it. I mean, I mean, I know for some guys, you know, if you don't like it, you want to get away from it, then don't come here because once you sign your name on the dotted line to come here, it doesn't make any difference, if you were the 12th guy on the team or the superstar, guy on the team. If you support this program with the right attitude and do what you gotta do, whether you're here for one year like it is now, or if you stay for all four years like it was, you know, back when we played then if you do what you supposed to 00:15:00do, the fans are gonna love you forever. And I'm just glad that I'm a part of.

Interviewer: Let's go through your career, if you would. Year by year, starting in eighty, 83, eighty three as you came in. You talked earlier about not, not sure of yourself that you could play at that level or making that transition. And you come in with the senior class of Derek or Charles Hurt, Derek Minnifield and Sam Bowie, although he didn't play the games that year, and Melvin Turpin, which was a pretty strong class. Again, how long did it take you before you felt like you fit in with that group?

Walker: Well, I remember give during the recruiting process. Coach always honest with me. He said, Kenny, we have Derek Hoard. Derek was coming off all SEC year, his junior year in Charles Hurt, boy, guy was built like Atlas, my goodness! He was amazing. And they all were like big brothers to me. But he told me, he said, 00:16:00"Kenny it's gonna be hard for you to be a starter." He said, "You can get in there and put some playing time and we'll we'll find a way to get you on the floor. But it's gonna be tough because these guys are experience they're big and strong. You know, you're gonna have to hit the weights and really work hard to really earn that playing time." But I couldn't ask for a better situation because you talking about showing me the ropes. But those guys would throw me around in practice like I was a rag doll. But it was fun. It was fun from the standpoint that it made me, you know, want to fight, it made me want to get better. It made me want to get, you know, stronger. And those guys really took care of me. And it was a great way to challenge myself. You know, each and every day. And I give them really all of the credit in the world because, you know, back then it was really hard to beat out juniors and seniors, not like it is now, your great freshman, they just throw you out there and play. 00:17:00So you had to fight for that playing time. And those guys made me earn it.

Interviewer: And you were basically the sixth man played in every game that you're all 31 games, right?

Walker: Yeah, played in all 31 games. And, you know, I was very fortunate. And give certainly Derek and Charles a lot of credit. You know, from the forward position of battling those guys every day in practice. But I have to give credit to Dicky Beal. Dirk Minniefield, Roger Harden, who came in when I did. I played with some really good guards. And Dirk Minniefield from a leadership perspective, really did wonders for my ego as a freshman. He knew I was a shy, kind of introverted guy and, man, when I came in to ball games, he was always in my ear. "You can do this. You can do that. I'm going to throw the ball to you. Just tell me where you want it." He had so much confidence in me. And I respected him 00:18:00for that. And I really didn't want to let him down because he was always saying, "you can do it, you can do it." So really, you know, outside of, you know, the coaches finally, you know, I think towards the end of the year, I gained their respect and confidence. You know, that I could eventually get in there and help the team. But I think it was Dirk Minniefield, was the guy that really led that spark upon me.

Interviewer: Sam Bowie, he was one of the seniors that year, but didn't play any game with that, didn't have any effect on the team. Was he coming back? Was he not coming? Or did you know right away you wanted to play well?

Walker: Thank goodness I was a freshman then. I wasn't really paying attention to all of that. But obviously when I look back on that year, I didn't realize everything that Sam had went through before I came here. So like as a freshman, it was a big enough adjustment for me, just trying to figure out how can I help the team and what my role would be. But I know it was tough 00:19:00on Sam. You know, to see him on crutches, you know, every day, you know, coming practice. You know, he come in and do his treatment, do his ehab. He was probably the most supportive, you know, guy, you know, that we had, you know, during that season. I got my nickname. You know, Skywalker. You know, it was either Bowie or Coach Lynard Hamilton, it was at the very first midnight madness, which was my freshman year. And we had about 11,000 people come out to Memorial Coliseum. And that's first time I ever played in front of that many people. I mean, I played in a McDonald's All-American game in Chicago. But I think it was only about like 8,000 people at that game. So my very first midnight madness practice, we have 11,000 people at Memorial Coliseum and I'm nervous and I never knew that I could jump the way that I've been on that 00:20:00night. I knew I could. Don't go do something. But when you're nervous and excited, that energy gets going, you know, its just amazing on what you can do. And I remember just doing all of these crazy dunks and the fans kept getting louder and louder and louder. And so like the louder they got the higher I jumped. And after it was all over and I think Sam and Lynard Hamilton, they was talking and he was like, "Man, he was like Skywalker!" And, you know, Sam was over on his crutches and they were talking about it. And one of the reporters heard it. And that's how that nickname kind of gets stuck with me. Probably from my very first midnight madness practice. But Sam was there. He was you know, it was tough, you know, because you can tell. You know, obviously he wanted to play. And I think that was his second bout, you know, going dealing with a broken leg so it was very tough for him to watch.

Interviewer: You talked about the Midnight Madness, which Joe Hall, a lot of people give him credit for starting the craze that, you know, swept the country. From the first one that you participated in to nowadays, 00:21:00it's changed a little bit hasn't it?

Walker: Well, it's a big production now, obviously, with ESPN and everybody's getting involved with it, you know, I'm not knocking it. You know, I think it's great for the fans. And it's a great way to obviously, you know, introduced a freshman, I think, mainly to the big blue nation. And I think, you know, when you go to do it, you're going to do it right. You know, Kentucky, we don't we don't follow trends, we set them here. So we, we set trends now still with the big blue madness. And so now, like every aspect of it, because I think it helps recruiting. But back I guess when Coach Hall first started, it meant you had to really be a fan to to get out there, to be a part of it. You know, because you had to wait until midnight. I 00:22:00remember the speculation that we had that day going to class. Guys were saying, "Well, it might be about maybe five, six thousand people there." So, you know, so. And still, that was a large number of people that had to wait out til midnight to actually get in. And, you know, as the day went by, you could just see people start to line up at the coliseum all the way til midnight. You know, they lined up all the way from the Memorial Coliseum over to the Wildcat Lodge. So when we eventually went over to the Memorial Coliseum to do the Big Blue Madness, about I guess we all went over about eleven o'clock, man. It was just like going through a sea of UK fans. They just kind of parted and kind of let us walk through the crowd, so it was pretty fun.

Interviewer: What the players think, when or how did Coach Hall, I guess, sell it to you guys are trying to describe-- "we're going to have big blue madness" ?

Walker: Well, he --

Interviewer: Did you all think he was crazy when he was practicing?

Walker: Well, absolutely. And you know Coach Hall has been known to be, you know, innovative, you know, for a lot of things, especially his preseason workout, which I think we all would agree that, you know, maybe it helped a little bit or maybe that was his way of just having fun trying something out. But he I think he wanted to give something to the fans. And, you know, he did that Big Blue Midnight Madness, you know, as a way to introduce the team to the UK fans. And I think it was a great idea. Obviously, it was a caught on by a lot of, you know, different schools who who did it. You know, and have a success with it. But not only would he do those those midnight madness, he also would do those blue and white games and he would schedule them, you know, throughout the state at different high schools. We would do a couple in western Kentucky and 00:24:00then we would do a couple in eastern Kentucky. Play at a high school. And the fans will come pack the gym, 5000 people get in small gyms and watch us play and practice against each other. So I thought Coach Hall, because I think he had so many years around Coach Adolph Rupp in his right hand recruiter, I think he picked up a lot of things from Coach Rupp in terms of how to market, how to spread the UK brand. And when he was coming into the 70s, going into the 80s, this is when ESPN and some of these other cable companies started to take off. And I think coach Hall kind figured out, "hey, let me come up with some things way to promote the program." And I think he took advantage of it.

Interviewer: They don't allow those blue white scrimmages anymore. But as a freshman in going down to eastern Kentucky, I mean, that probably was one of your first experiences about how the fans of Kentucky basketball really are.

Walker: Well, that was a unique experience. You know, you come in on the bus. I mean, you got people literally going crazy. Not only do you have babies crying and old ladies crying. You have grown men crying that, you know, they're finally going to get an opportunity to see what are their favorite, you know, wildcat. In those games, you know, for a guy like me as a freshman, I mean, they're like real games. You know, they were different from practice because anytime that you put a team in front of a crowd, then the intensity goes up. And I remember the feeling, you know, I just got, you know, walking into those little small buildings. It was kind of like a scene out of a Hoosiers movie, you know, where you got people everywhere and, you know, in these little, small gyms. And they love basketball. And this was the only time that they probably was going to get a chance to see the wildcat play. So it was just like 00:26:00the biggest game, you know, for them. And it made it was a competitive atmosphere for us. So it was a lot of fun.

Interviewer: Let's get back to this season. It said you were twenty three and eight during that 82-83 season, won the SEC regular season. But Alabama got you the first game of the conference tournament by five. 69-64 I think was the final score. Do you remember anything about that game?

Walker: I just remember as a freshman, that was my first SEC tournament game and then I was just- the intensity went up from what the regular season games were. To me, that was my first introduction of big time college basketball. I think on a personal level I didn't play too well. I think the only guy that really, you know, play well in a tournament game was probably Big Melvin Turpin and we probably should have got the ball to him maybe a little bit more. But but I don't know what it was. You know, I just knew that the intensity, you know, just you know, from my freshman year, it was different from the regular season 00:27:00game. And then, of course, we went into the NCAA tournament and the intensity went on up more.

Interviewer: So you go to Knoxville for the NCAA as the number 3 seed. You beat Ohio by 17. If you recall anything from these games just go ahead--

Walker: Now, I don't remember the Ohio game.

Interviewer: Then you beat Indiana by five.

Walker: I remember that game! Definitely. Definitely remember the Indiana game. The Indiana game was a rematch from early in the year. They had a big center named (??) from Germany, about 7'2, 7'3. Randy Wittman was on that team. And I think Ted Kitchell, who was there, I guess, two big guns. That took us out, I guess, in Indiana earlier that year. So this was a rematch. And it was a hard fought game. I mean, Indiana had a very good team. Of course, you know, Bobby 00:28:00Knight, that was when he was pretty much, you know, near at his prime of coaching. So I remember it going back and forth. You know, it went down to the wire. We ended up, I think, pulling it out of close game in the end.

Interviewer: Yeah, you won by five that game, which sets up the game with the University of Louisville. That's the one they called the dream game, right?

Walker: Yes.

Interviewer: How is the hype going into that game? Because those two schools really hadn't met in years.

Walker: Look, again, I'm so glad that I was a freshman, because I think for me, I didn't have any time to think about Louisville or the fans or anything else. My focus was like, "Okay, let me just try to figure out what I can do to help the team out." But you could tell that the hype around the game was different. The fans have been anticipating this game for a long time. The 00:29:00year before, Kentucky was supposed to meet Louisville in the tournament, but I think they lost to Middle Tennessee or somebody. Remember a lot of people making fun of me about that in high school because I was going to Kentucky. They got beat by Middle Tennessee. But I said, "well, I'll get there and I'll help them out the next year. That won't happen." So the first time that Kentucky and Louisville had met in the modern era and what I remember about that game, was that they didn't have a whole lot of time to hype it because it was just in between us beating, you know, Indiana. So they only had one day. I don't remember reading anything in the paper. I think I just kind of stayed away from this stuff. But we went to the arena the next day. It was a strange scene. We're planned on the University of Tennessee's court, which is orange. And we didn't have a lot of success in Stokely. At least I did 00:30:00until my senior year. And it was just so weird place, place sort of happened. You had the orange court, you had half of the crown blue and you had the other half red. The governor walks in and he has on a blazer. Half of it is blue. Half of it is red. And he's waving and walking around.

Interviewer: Who is the governor?

Walker: Jay -- John Y. Brown was the governor at that time. So that it was just a crazy atmosphere. And the game was probably the best game, at least for 40 minutes that I was probably ever involved with the intensity that both teams play with. I mean, it was back in forth. They would make big shots. We would make big shots. They would go down and dunk couple, we'll come down and dunk a 00:31:00couple. They'll reject a couple of shots and we will block a couple of shots. I mean, I never really going into that ballgame, never had my shot rejected. But I remember Rodney and Scooter McCray both rejected my shots a couple of times. So, you know, utilize the pump fake a little bit. But it was it was fun playing in that game in and of course it was a neck nip and tuck. I remember Jim Masters making a deep corner shot to actually send the game into overtime. I wish we had the three point line at that time, because if he makes that shot, we win it and then we go home and the game is over. But we go into overtime. And I don't know, we just ran out of gas or what happened. But they hit us with a full court press and we just couldn't get the ball across half court. We throwing it all over the place. And I think they went on like a 12-2 run and some overtime. They eventually blew the game open. But that 00:32:00was the original dream game, which was fun. It was one play, though, at the end of that game. I now remember it like it's yesterday. Dirk Minniefield going down the baseline, usually Dirk Minniefield who, before John Wall came along, I would say probably was probably the most gifted athletic guard to play at UK. Usually he dunks that basketball. He went for a lay up and Charles Jones, just got up enough of it to reject it. And the game I guess, in going into overtime. But if Dirk would have dunked that basketball would take about a minute to go in the game, I think we would have had it.

Interviewer: There's a lot of talk among fans, obviously, the excitement of playing that game. Was there much trash talking going on during the game?

Walker: The players from both sides and I was fortunate to play in a lot of those games because after that game, I think the hype and the popularity, the TV 00:33:00ratings, just everything that happened with it, they forced the schools to play the next year. I know Coach Hall was against that policy because I think Coach Rupp had a policy where they didn't play the in-state school because they felt like, you know, Kentucky had everything to lose and everybody else had everything to gain. So I can understand that. But I think after that game that all went out the window, they forced us to play, and then, kinda ironically, you know, we played again the next year. And not only we played in I think, it might have been the first, second game of the season. We played well earlier in the year and then we played them again in the Sweet 16 and we got a chance to get some revenge in that ball game. Probably helped out of that that it was in Rupp Arena.

Interviewer: So let's go to the next year, 83-84. The team finishes 29-5. 00:34:00Bowie is back, healthy to play. The new recruits, Winston Bennett signs on. James Blackmon. They're both freshmen. So again, very talented squad. You win your first 12 games. So the loss of all those seniors that you guys made, that adjustment pretty well.

Walker: Made the adjustment pretty well. Well, it certainly helps out when you have Sam Bowie coming back, which, you know, Sam was a little bit, I think, rusty throughout the year because he knows it's very difficult to sit out two years and go through what he went through to be the player that he was. So, you know, we were trying to, you know, fit him in. And then, of course, you mentioned James Blackmon and Winston Bennett, two very talented freshmen. And, you know, Winston Bennett, you know, to this day I'm so glad, when he got a little bit older so he and I could play on the same team together in practice. 00:35:00Because Winston was a he was an enforcer. He didn't back down for anybody, you know, he was so aggressive as a freshman. His first day of practice, he got in he got in three fights in his first day of practice, got in a fight with Bowie, he got in a fight with Turpin and he got in a fight with, I think, Brett Baer or Tom Height, one of those guys. And I remember at the practice Joe B. Hall saying, "I love this Winston Bennett! I want five more guys that go and play with the passion and the toughness that he has." I said, "If we have five more guys like that, we're gonna beat the hell out of each other in practice. We're not gonna be able to play." But Winston was-- he brought that intensity, you know, every day in practice. And James Blackmon and probably had one of the best freshman years that I've seen of any guard that I have actually played with.

Interviewer: You in Winston and didn't play the same spot though, right?

Walker: Yeah. Well, actually, I went back and forth between the three and the four. Winston kinda came off the bench and he back me up in terms of, you know, what was going on that year. Our starting 5 was Big Mel was in the center position. Sam played a power forward position. I was at small forward and we had Jim Masters at Guard. And then eventually Dickey Beal took over that starting guard spot from Roger Harden. They kind of went back and forth throughout the year.

Interviewer: I mentioned you won the first twelve games and in that list of games won, you beat University of or you beat Indiana, you won at Kansas, beat BYU at Cincinnati at Illinois beat Purdue. And then your first four conference games, you talk about a strength of schedule.

Walker: Yeah, that was we we was loaded up that year, you know, of course at Kansas, man, that's a tougher environment. You know, that you that you can, 00:37:00you know, play in. But again, you know, the Twin Towers, I mean, Bowie and Turpin, they were huge for us early in our career and to your offense and you kind of figure things how your defenses work carries you and we were very good defensive team, obviously. You know, we had some guys that we could play for perimeter defense. But boy, you know, you had a great, great wall back there to protect you when you had Bowie and Turpin. So when, we play Louisville early in the year, very athletic team. Lancaster, Gore and Milt Wagoner, Billy Thompson and those guys you mentioned. You know Kansas. You know Indiana. I mean, all of those schools were really tough. And at the top of their game at that time, I think that really helped us that you're prepared for the SEC, at least if you would think that it would prepare you for the SEC. We come through the 00:38:00non-conference unblemished, which was kind of surprising with the schedule we played. It wasn't until we had conference play that we kind of hit a little bump in the road.

Interviewer: I want to ask you about one of those preconference games on December 20th. You played Cincinnati.

Walker: Oh!

Interviewer: The score was 24-11.

Walker: That was the worst game. I remember Joe B. Hall being so excited for the fans in northern Kentucky. They finally got to get an opportunity to see the Wildcats play. The ticket sales were great. The fans came out. Everybody was all pumped up to just-- and then course we had the number one team in the country, man. So we were rolling. And they come out in a play stall ball because this is before the shot clock and they come out. We take like a 6-2 lead. They just started taking the air out of the basketball and Coach Hall just instructed us 00:39:00to play his own defense and we just kind of watched them pass the ball around for most of the game, I don't think I broke a sweat. They probably didn't even have to wash my uniform. That's just how boring it was. And but they tried to play in the last, I guess, four or five minutes of the game. I remember the final score was like 24-19 or whatever it was. You know, it just it was awful for the fans, you know, to sit there and watch that. And I remember Joe B. Hall coming out after the game, doing an interview, apologizing to the fans for that brand of basketball. And he vowed that once that contract was over with, the University of Cincinnati, I think we have three more games to play after that, he said that he would never play the University Cincinnati again. And I don't think we ever did until we met them in the tournament.

Interviewer: Your first loss then after those twelve games to start the season, 00:40:00was to Auburn, I think was at Auburn, right. Players you talked about earlier, the Charles Barkley, (??). How that go over for you?

Walker: Well, needless to say, Charles, let me know about it. You know, I said that I picked the wrong school and I should've came to Auburn and all of the trash that he was talking at that time. But that's when Barkley that was what I call really the really the rebound when he was over 300 pounds. But I remember going down there. Auburn was just there was so hype for that ballgame. I mean, Charles Barkley, well, he intimidated a lot of people, but boy, he could really get inside of Melvin's, you know, head in, boy. He he really got inside Melvin's head early in that ballgame when he dunked off a rebound, I think was over Bowie and Turpin. And then Chuck Person was making shots. It seemed like it was about 35, 40 feet from the basket. Thank goodness there weren't no 00:41:00three pointers. You know, back then, because Person probably would've had 40 points himself. You know, from the distance that he was. But they they they were ready for it. They were pumped up. They blew us out, gave us our very first conference loss for a first loss of the year. So needless to say, we were really (??) after that game and kind of down the line a little sorry for ourselves, but we didn't have much room to get I guess wait. We had left right there and I think went down to Auburn couple I mean, from Auburn to Florida, and I think couple days after that, I think Florida laid one on us.

Interviewer: You lost back to back, that's right. How was Coach Hall after that?

Walker: Oh, well, put it this way. We did so many suicides, you know, in between the Auburn game and then after the Florida game. And I know you've heard the term "get a wall." I don't know how many walls that we got. You know 00:42:00that at those, I think what are the practices lasted for about three and a half, four hours because it was a time no time limit on practice back then. Needless to say, he wasn't the gentle, kind Joe B. Hall that we hear on the radio and the fans love right now. Needless to say, he had some things to say to us in between those practices that I can't quite repeat on camera here.

Interviewer: You mentioned that Auburn fans came out big for the game. And that's kind of normal whenever Kentucky goes in play. Is that an advantage or disadvantage? Is the fact help you get up for the game being on the road.

Walker: I mean, for me personally, I kind of like that environment. You know, I'm quite sure with some gods, they get really nervous going into that situation. Nothing made me more than happy to go to, especially back then Florida. You know, Gator Alley. Or LSU. Dale Brown and the tiger coming out of 00:43:00the ceiling and they line up two hours before the game just to boo you when you get out the bus. And the same thing in Tennessee. So nothing made me more happy than to be in in that environment to have 20--, 18-20,000 people going crazy, calling you all kinds of names. Booing you. And then you go there and get a slam dunk and the whole place is goes quiet, you know, or you walk in off that floor after they've called you every name in the book and you walk in off that floor, you don't have to say anything, just smile, like look at the scoreboard and walk off the court. But I love I love those atmospheres. And of course, during the time that, you know, we played some of these coaches and the personality, you know, Don (??), Wimp Sanders, you know, of course, (??) do the 00:44:00Sonny Smith and all of these guys, they they they werw great. You know, they were great for the game.

Interviewer: So that season, your team goes on, you win the regular season, you go to Nashville for the SEC tournament and you win the tournament, thereby knocking off Georgia by 13.Alabama and a close win. 48-46. And a rematch then with Auburn.

Walker: Yes.

Interviewer: And you hit the game winner there.

Walker: Yeah. Yeah. We we split during the regular season. I mean, as you stated earlier, we we got blown out in Auburn and we came back to Rupp Arena. We actually blew them out in Rupp Arena. But I think by 18, 20 points. So this was a rubber match. You know, third time, Charles Barkley, the SEC player of the year, you know, over, you know, Bowie and Turpin and the guys that we had on our team, they probably deserved it because he was a great player. Man. That game 00:45:00was going back and forth and back and forth and cause get down to the last, I guess, eight seconds in the ballgame. We have the ball. Coach Hall called the timeout. You know, he's in the huddle. He's drawing up this play and he's going like, "Ok, they probably think we're going to go to Master, or we're going to go to Bowie, gonna go to Turpin or Bowie. Kenny got to run this play. Go have Sam Bowie, Melvin Turpin set a double pick on the baseline. I'm gonna rub my man off and come around to the elbow in Diffie, build on the deliver a pass. And I'm going to go and take Kenny just when you get it. Just don't worry about it. You can have no time to just get it off. If it goes in, great. Whatever if worst possible scenario goes in overtime." Course my eyes probably got that big because I couldn't believe that he was actually drawing up to play for me. But somehow we would go back out on the 00:46:00floor and actually Jim Masters and Dickey roles got reversed where Dickey couldn't get the ball. So Jim actually was a point guard on the play. Rub my guy off that pick and Bowie and Turpin was able to get just enough Chuck Person to free me up. So when I caught it with about, I guess, two seconds to go. I have no time to elevate. And I must admit, it wasn't the previous shot in the world. It was it was a line drive. It went straight and hit it hit the front of the rim and then it bounced up about two feet over the rim and then it was switched back through with no time on the clock in a course. As time expired, the camera pans to Charles Barkley and he's crying, you know, on the floor. And Bill Keightley, Sam Bowie, Joe B. Hall, everybody's rubbing my head. We're all celebrating. You know, it was arguably probably the biggest shot 00:47:00of my maybe my career. A lot of fans, you know, call in on my radio show and they talk about that moment and they always say, Kenny, you're the only guy to make Charles Barkley cry. So that's probably my claim to fame. I'm quite sure Charles probably don't like to hear that though.

Interviewer: So after winning the SEC tournament, then you guys go into the NCAA as the number one seed. You have a rematch with BYU again, beat them decisively in Birmingham, which is a lot of times where the SEC tournament in both games. You scored 93 points against BYU.

Walker: Yeah, we are. I mean, they just they were tough match up. I mean, we were tough match up with them. We had guards, like I say, Blackmon, Roger Hart, Dickey Beal, Jim Masters, we could play fast. We could play slow, which is I mean, Bowie and Turpin. I mean, both of those guys not only blocking shots on 00:48:00defense, but the pressure that they put on offense. I mean, I didn't know how much fun it was to play basketball with two 7 footers that could actually play. Everybody's game plan to stop, you know, Bowie and Turpin. A lot of people don't know, I was the second leading and scorer on the on the final four team, you know, because nobody ever paid any attention to me, you know? And that was fun because once boy interprete moved on, then the double teams and triple teams start coming my way. And of course, it was a whole lot different then.

Interviewer: So then the next game you knock off Louisville, which you talked about in Lexington, also beat Illinois. Takes you to the semifinal game NCAA semifinals in Seattle playing Georgetown University. You're ahead at halftime. 29-22. What's Coach Hall say at halftime to the team?

Walker: Man! I feel bad for Coach Hall because so many fans have asked me, what did he say at halftime? Last time I checked, coaches don't score baskets. You know, I think I don't care what he said. When you come out and you go three of 33 from the field, it's very difficult to beat anybody. And the reason why I felt bad for Coach Hall was because this was supposed to be his year. Bowie's back, Turpin. I'm in my sophomore year. You got Dickey Beal, Jim Master's, seniors. You got Winston Bennett, James Blackmon, Roger Harden coming off the bench. We overcome, you know, a few bumps in the road. And we were right there. Like you say, at halftime, we were exactly where we want to be. Seven point lead, controlling the ball game. I think Patrick Ewing was in a 00:50:00little bit of foul trouble and I remember Coach Hall coming in and saying, "Guys, we play great the first half. Got 20 more minutes. Lets go out there put the hammer down. Keep playing hard, keep playing smart. We're going to be playing in the championship game on Monday night." When we walk down on the floor for the second half, I think everybody really believed that we were going to be playing for the championship on Monday night. But it was like somebody put a lid like on the basket. I mean, we miss layups. We missed free throws. We missed you know, just shots I know guys normally made I've seen one or two guys go cold, but I haven't seen a whole team just go that cold. And it wasn't like Georgetown was burning it up. I think they were shooting a bad percentage as well. As bad as we shot the ball in the second half. I guess three 00:51:00of 33 from the field, 9.1%. If we shoot 20%, 25, 30%, we win the ballgame, but 9.1%. And of course, couple of years later, I get drafted by the New York Knicks and Patrick Ewing always reminded me about how Georgetown beat us that year. And boy, what could you say? You know, it's hard to take.

Interviewer: That game was in the King Dome, right?

Walker: It was in the kingdom. It's the first time that a championship game had been played in a big dome stadium. Now, I'm not gonna say that was the reason why we lost the ballgame, because obviously Georgetown had to play in the game, too. But I've played in a lot of domes and I don't particularly like it because it does, I think, especially for the perimeter guys, I do think the depth of perception really does affect your shooting. You look at even the championship games that are played in domes now, generally, the shooting 00:52:00percentages are not that good. So it all boils down to a team that can make the game ugly, make it physical. I think it's pretty much one from about 18 feet on it. You know, in the tournament.

Interviewer: I got to ask you this, too. There was a player they had named Graham. And did did the frontline players get a little bit intimidated by him?

Walker: Probably--

Interviewer: Because when I look at the shooting percentage, the front line, either three or four, four or five of you guys count Winston Bennett 7 for 32.

Walker: Yeah. Not not good. Not good. Not to make any excuses. Not to say that, you know, Graham didn't have an effect, but he-- that Georgetown team coming into that game, they were pretty much they will be there before the bad boy pistons of the NBA. They their game was intimidation. Big John Thompson was their coach. And he's a 6'10 guy. Backup to Bill Russell for a lot of the 00:53:00Celtics team. And he had big Ralph Dalton, seven footer. Patrick Ewing, 7-foot. Graham 6'10. And these guys, you know, they were going to lay the wood on you. We knew that going into the ballgame. It didn't affect us in the first half. We got them in foul trouble. We were playing our ball game. But maybe somewhere as the game went on, maybe it did take an affect because Graham was the type of guy, I mean, this is before Charles Barkley and Michael Jordan with the bald head. This guy was a mean dude. And the only guy that really kind of battle, I think any of those guys, you know, first from a physical standpoint in that ballgame was Winston. Of course, Winston was going to back down from anybody. That was the day that we probably needed five more Winston Bennetts out on the court and then it didn't have it. But. But, yeah, I would say, though, 00:54:00that their physicality probably had something to do with the game.

Interviewer: How long did it take you to kind of overcome that loss?

Walker: You never overcome that loss. I mean, I have people to this day still ask me, "Kenny, what happened in the second half?" And that's why I feel bad for, you know, Coach Hall, because as a coach, you know, he you know, he said, well, you had Bowie, Turpin, Walker and all these guys, and he could win it. You know, sometimes it's just bad luck. You know, just bad second half. Unfortunately for us, it happened on the biggest stage and at the most difficult time for Kentucky fan. It's something that we're going to have to live with for the rest of our lives. I remember talking to Coach Hall, you know, years after that game, and he told me, "Kenny, I thought that was going to be my last game and I was going to walk away after that ballgame. Win the championship. Ride out into the sunset." He said that it left such a bad taste in its mouth 00:55:00that he actually came back for one more year. And God bless him for that, because, you know, the year that we had, you know, probably wasn't the proper sendoff, at least for the from a regular-season standpoint, didn't flare too well. But we were lucky enough to get in tournament. And then I think we gave him a little bit enjoyment and kind of teased some people, at least for a little bit.

Interviewer: Yeah, let's talk about that. '84-'85. Your team's 18-13. Kind of an up and down season. But along the way you had a pretty good wins. You knocked off number 11, Kansas. Beat North Carolina State who also ranked at the time. What was it? Why was the team (?) because the new freshmen, I guess were Davender--

Walker: Yeah.

Interviewer: Richard Madison.

Walker: Yeah.

Interviewer: Rob Locke and Cedric Jenkins.

Walker: Well this is when you feel the effects of the loss of the "Twin Towers." You know, I think we recruited well Rob Locke and Cedric would eventually become pretty good role players for future Kentucky teams in their junior and senior 00:56:00year. But coming in as a freshman, that was kind of a tall order to kind of put on those two guys, Cedric and Rob, to do what Bowie and Turpin had done. Different kind of skillset, different kind of players. So I remember starting off 1-4 that year and Coach Hall called me in his office. And he said, "Kenny, I've been trying different things with these freshmen and different lineups." He says, "Son, you're basically going to have to go out and average about 25 points and 10 or 12 rebounds for us to win."

Interviewer: Were you upset?

Walker: Not really. And and and he said "You're going to have to give it to us every night." And he said, "You're gonna have to play out of position in order to do that," because with Bowie and Turpin, I was playing my natural forward position. You know, I had a kind of a Jack Givens role, flash in the middle of the zone, make little spot up jump shots, lob pass dunks and stuff like that. But to be the guy, to actually post up and, you know, get a lot of touches, you 00:57:00know, yeah, I was willing to do it, but there was a price to pay because opposing teams knew --hey, this is pretty much all they have, you know, right now. God bless Winston because, you know at 6'7-6'8, man me and him had to battle guys that were much bigger than we were. But we did it and we were inconsistent because we were so young and we really didn't hit our stride, unfortunately for us, until we got into the NCAA tournament, because if I recall correctly, I think we got put out the very first game of the SEC tournament by the University of Florida. And I remember several guys going on spring break then think that we were going to get into the tournament. When they had selection Sunday and we saw Kentucky as the 12th seed, we had to get on the 00:58:00phone and call some guys and tell them to come back in town because, you know, we've got to we've got to go to the tournament. And that was probably the most fun I think I've ever seen Coach Hall have. Because when we went to practice, he was loose. He knew that we weren't supposed to be there, I guess. And there was no pressure. And it was probably the first time in his coaching career that he was coaching and didn't have any pressure. And boy, we we made the most of it. I remember him saying, hey, if they don't let us go dancing, we might as well dance as long as we can. And we upset the University of Washington. First game, I think, in the NCAA tournament that they had a superstar player by the name of Detlef Schrempf, 6'9 German guy. That could really do it all. And then they had a center, another German guy, Christen Welt, I think was his name, a 7'2 guy, both of those guys eventually played in the NBA and 00:59:00they had long, good careers. So we played them in the very first game and we knocked them off. And then we play your UNLV, I think in the second game out of Salt Lake City, Utah. And never forget, Tark the Shark chewing that towel and Coach Hall, again, he was having fun, He was like, "Guys, these guys gonna run and gun and they're gonna dunk and everything," he said, "but we're gonna play with them. We're gonna play our game." And he had Rodger at the point guard, and he said "Rodger, you just go out there and let it fly." And of course he should have never told Roger that. You know, Rodger, you know, that was right up his alley. Rodger was thrown behind the back passes, dribbling between his legs. I mean, it was like it was like an all star game. It was a high scoring affair. And it was back and forth and back and forth. And we actually beat him at their own game. I remember Richard Madison coming off the bench late in that 01:00:00ballgame, contributing a couple of key defensive plays and rebounds and, and stuff like that. And I was able to get a key block at the end of that ballgame in a lay up on the other end to kind of seal the win. But boy, we were we were having a lot of fun because the final vote was in Rupp Arena that year. And only then we had to do was to win a couple more games to get back to Rupp Arena. So that was our start. You know, to win those first couple games and then to get to the sweet sixteen.

Interviewer: Yeah. So just kind of backup. You start the term as a 12 seed. And you think that's really what kind of changed from the regular season play--

Walker: Yeah.

Interviewer: --maybe this point season into an exciting postseason. But you mentioned you're in Salt Lake and then you go to Denver, another altitude. So when you're playing, did you really ever notice finding out? Did it have any affect on you?

Walker: When I was in college, I didn't. Later on in the pros, I think psychologically, because you think about it so much, it was probably more of a 01:01:00factor then. But of course, when you're in college, you know, 18, 19 years old, you know, I mean, I don't think you're going to see that much difference. But we got we got sent out west because of the low seed--

Interviewer: Right.

Walker: --and really, we felt like it was the Kentucky name that got us in. We had some good wins. Played a tough schedule, had some tough losses. But we felt like it was the Kentucky name that got to us in. But once we got in, we felt like we were we were in a good region where we could do some damage. And that was obvious by, like I said, when in those first couple of games. So after we won those first couple games, now we go to Denver for the, you know, Sweet 16 and the Elite Eight. And you know for Coach Hall, he started out at Regis College, I guess little small college there in Denver. We practiced at that facility before we played that sweet, sweet 16 game against St. John. And we 01:02:00went around the campus and he kind of showed us where it all started for him. And man, he was just really, really relax. I mean, he was having fun. I mean, he was a kidding with the media and love and all the fans, you know, being around them and you've been around Coach Hall usually during games and in media he's very businesslike. And we just noticed that he would just really relaxed. We just thought he was just having fun. You know, coaching and moving along in a tournament. I remember going into the St. John's game. We really believed that we could win that ballgame. And I had a great team. They had Chris Boland's who was there, all American, Walter Berry, who would eventually become a great player for St. John's. They have Mark Jackson, a backup point guard, and big Bill Wellington, who played a lot of the Chicago Bulls team. So they had a good team. They had a been battle in against Georgetown for 01:03:00the Big East championship back and forth. So they were ranked really high coming in. I don't know exactly what they were ranked, I think they were in the top five. But we had no business being there. And I, remember, man, that the first half of that ball game. It was awesome. We had the same game plan that we had against UNLV. We're going to try to run. We've got to try to push the tempo and, of course like I said, Roger, loved those type of game, man. And we were going up and down. And then about midway through the first half, Chris Mullens and in overtly poked me in the eye not trying to steal the ball from me. No foul was called on the play and I end up being taken out of the ballgame. He stretched my cornea right above my eye and my eyes swelled up like a boxer. Ended up playing basically the rest of the game with one eye, you know. But during a time that they were tending to me on the sideline, I think it was a 01:04:00tied game maybe when I went out, but I missed about by three or four minutes while they're working on my eye. By the time that I came back in, they had increased their lead a little bit. And course, what a good team like that you can't spot them double digit points and then expect that you'll come back. So we made a run towards the end of the ballgame. But that deficit was a little bit too much to overcome.

Interviewer: After the game, Joe B. retires. Where did you hear it? How shocked were you?

Walker: Well, you know, like I said, go to that tournament, we knew he was a little bit more relaxed. I think he knew, you know, going into that, that, you know, whenever it ends, it was going to be his last game. But he didn't tell anybody. You know, obviously, people were kind of reacting and to, you know, you know, how he was acting. You know, just how laid back he was. And there was a question about that. But um I remember after the game, everything was normal. We get on the bus, you know, just waiting for Coach Hall to finish 01:05:00up his coach's show with Caywood. And I remember one of the state troopers that always travel with us on the bus right there. He came to the bus and he said, guys, Coach Hall is announcing his retirement on the on with the postgame show with Caywood. And of course, if you are still in shock with the loss, you know. You know, if that wasn't it, you know, you know, big enough. Here's this news that Coach Hall is retiring. So for me personally, this is after my junior year and I've had, you know, stat wise, my my greatest season at UK. Averaged about 23 points a game almost. And I think almost 11 rebounds. So when I heard the retirement, I'm initially thinking, "Okay, since Coach Hall is 01:06:00retiring, I've had this good season. I mean, should I go to the NBA now? I mean should I stick around and try to get used to a new coach? Is it worth it to stay and all that?" So, you know, we all just sitting on the bus thinking about, you know, all of those things. Of course, you know, Coach Hall gets on the bus and, you know, he talks to everybody, told everybody that he retired. And, you know, I take a lot of guys, you know, we, you know, just kind of feeling the same things. You know, you try to get all the emotions of the loss, now you're hearing this and this you try and figure out, you know, what you're going to do. But the thing I like about Coach Hall you know, he came around to my room personally a little later on that night and talk to me and and told me the reasons, you know, why he was, you know, doing those type of things, and I can respect, and you know, I understand that. But a lot of emotions were going on. But I decided to give myself, at least until they found out who the next coach 01:07:00was going to be. Try to just sit down and talk to that guy and see what kind of game plan maybe he would have for myself and for, you know, UK and see where we go from there. And fortunately, you know, for me and my family, my family wasn't pushing me out the door. And I think it was very important for them, for me to get my education. And I was being told that I can get drafted anywhere from the middle to the late first round. And I based my decision on coming back to get that degree. And I was told that if I came back for my senior year, I could be drafted maybe even higher and if I got drafted higher, I could go to a team where I could play to a poor team that maybe didn't make the playoffs. And that was key to me coming back. And I'm glad that I made that decision, because coming back for my senior year, I almost reached my dream of winning an NCAA championship and then I increased my draft position to number five overall.

Interviewer: Did anyone with the administration or the hiring process people, did anybody talk to you about the selection of who the coach -- do you have any input on that?

Walker: No, not really. But, you know, I was constantly in contact with Cliff Hagan at that time. You know, Coach Hall played a vital part in, you know, the next guy. So I was excited because some of the names that you were hearing -- initially, a lot of people thought it was going to be Lute Olson from Arizona, you know, that will come and take over, which, of course, you saw what he did at his career. That wouldn't have been a bad decision. And then you you hear about, oh, who's the guy that used coach UCLA that was at UAB?

Interviewer: Gene Bartow?

Walker: Gene Bartow. He was another name that was always out there. Of course, Al McGuire was a hot name who had just recently retired from Marquette. So you 01:09:00knew Kentucky was gonna get somebody that was, you know, really, you know, really good. But I think what kind of scared some of those coaches off maybe was the high expectations then, you know, just you think you know all about Kentucky basketball until you actually get here and visit and move around and see how it works. But they eventually, obviously settle on Eddie Sutton which--

Interviewer: What was your first impression?

Walker: Well, I like Eddie because Eddie Sutton has a lot of fire and he's still to this day, probably the best man to man defensive coach I played for. And what convinced me to come back was Eddie pretty much saying, "Kenny, I'm not going to change anything what Joe Hall did with you offensively," he said. "But I think my principle and way we go play defense and style of play that I'm gonna play, it's gonna benefit you, its gonna benefit us and we're going to win a lot of games." And he came in with a lot of swag, if 01:10:00you want to call it, at that time and I tell you what, he could back it up and look, that first year at the University of Kentucky I think people forget about how good, you know, Eddie Sutton really was because of the way that it ended. When you look at my 1985-85 team play, that's probably one of the most underrated teams in the history of uh UK basketball. You talking about a three guard offense with Ed Davender, James Blackmon at at uh 6'4 playing a small forward position and Roger Harden. And then again me and Winston Bennett. The advantage that we had that year, Cedric Jenkins and Rob Locke was were better complementary players coming off the bench in that particular year because they had a year of experience. But boy, you talk about running and gunning in and plan and uptempo and and we could stop teams if we didn't have to play LSU 01:11:00for the fourth time. You know, who knows? Maybe we win a championship.

Interviewer: I was gonna ask you about the transition, but then you see the records, 32-4 actually transition wasn't too tough.

Walker: No, no. The transition was pretty good because I think Eddie Sutton was able to take the guards and get them to play with a little bit more confidence. I think I think that was the key. Not that that Coach Hall didn't do a good job with it, but, you know, he he played to our strengths a little bit more. And again, what I remember about him, we created so much offense from our defense because we would turn people over. We had guys that could really get out and deny the wings. We could really put pressure, you know, on the perimeter, guys. And Winston and I, even though we were undersized, we were both good enough at taking charges and blocking shots at the rim. So we had to pick and choose where 01:12:00we when we did those type of things. But we we all complemented each other really well. And again, it's a shame that we had to play LSU for the fourth time because I mean when you beat your team three out of four times, you know who the best team is. Unfortunately, in the NCAA tournament, they won when they needed to win. And we lost the most important game,

Interviewer: Before the tournament, your team went to Hawaii to play in a tournament over there. How much did that help the transition, getting to know each other? Coach Sutton, everything where you went on such a good run for a 32-4?

Walker: Well, you know, I mean, we didn't get a chance to play in, I guess, the Hawaiian shoot out of the I guess the Alaska shoot out. We scheduled some regular season games just to go to Hawaii. This was done in advance before even I think--

Interviewer: Oh, so this wasn't a tournament? It was just--

Walker: No they were just 2 regular season games. This wasn't even a tournament, but they wanted to give, you know, the seniors because we 01:13:00didn't have a trip where we either went to Hawaii, Alaska. So they scheduled regular season games. We went over to Maui to play (??) in the first game. We handled them pretty good. Then we flew from there to the main island to play the University of Hawaii. And we actually spent Thanksgiving there. And I remember just like always, when Kentucky travel, we had so many Kentucky fans there. We had this big luau. We had this big, you know, Thanksgiving dinner, you know, so we were we were actually over probably to Hawaii for about a week. You know, total. So it was a lot of fun. I think it's a great way to bond. And obviously with a new coach and the way that, you know, Coach Sutton was he was a little bit more laid back than Coach Hall in terms of the activities that he will let the players, you know, get out and do. So we could actually get out and ski and do things like that.

Interviewer: Really?

Walker: Unlike Coach Hall, who was afraid that, you know, somebody was gonna 01:14:00fall off, you know, a ski and get hurt, he didn't want that. So we actually enjoyed the trip. And I think his personality was really good for the guys that we had at that particular time.

Interviewer: The regular season line is down and the last home game is always senior night. What do you remember about your senior night?

Walker: Well, of course, we don't see many of those anymore because they leave out the one year. But I think every guy that has experienced senior night, I think that we will all say that it's probably the most special time, you know, in your basketball career while you're at the University of Kentucky. It doesn't make any difference if you've had bigger, better games. That was your last opportunity to play on the floor of Rupp Arena. And you get a chance to share that moment with your family and your friends. I look at 01:15:00pictures still to this day, my mother and father were so proud, you know, of me and my accomplishments in, you know, the four years that I had at the University of Kentucky. And when you see how happy they are and the tears are flowing from their eyes, you know, you can't help but, you know, feel those emotions. So it's kind of a bittersweet moment, obviously, because you're so happy and so many memories. But it's kind of a sad occasion because, you know, that's gonna be your last time actually playing on that floor. However, for me, it wasn't officially my last time because we had the SEC tournament that was in Rupp Arena. I guess a few weeks after that, it was last time that I think SEC school was able to host the SEC tournament.

Interviewer: And, y'all won.

Walker: And we won the tournament.

Interviewer: Now, in the tournament, the NCAA tournament, one of the games along the way, you had a pretty good night. You played Western Kentucky in the, I 01:16:00think the Sweet Sixteen it was. And tell us a little bit about that game.

Walker: Boy. And that was that was a really good night. First time that we played, I think, Western since I think the early 70s, I think they had beat us in the tournament back in 72 or 73. So it was--

Interviewer: Probably Jim McDaniels?

Walker: Yeah. Yeah, it was a lot of it was a lot of hype surrounding the game. Obviously, you know, Western being in state school, very good team at that time too. Billy Gordon was Lancaster Gordon's little brother. Lancaster played at Louisville. You had Canard Johnson 6'9. Power forward. Tellis Frank, 6'10. You know, four big clowns. (??), that guy was physical and rough and of course, coached by Clint Haskins. I think Dwane Casey was an assistant coach who recruited most of those guys. So they had a very good team. And when they walked 01:17:00out on the floor, they were quite bigger than us. I mentioned, Canard, Tellis Frank and Clarence, you know, of course, which is really me and Winston. And I remeber going "Man! It's gonna be really hard to kind of stop these guys from, you know, taking the ball to the basket." I mean, Canard Johnson was a left-handed guy and probably about 240-245. So he was a big dude, but thankful he played a finesse game. You know, he took a lot of shots away from the basket which I was proud, you know, that he was doing that. But that was a pretty good ball game and I got in a good rhythm. You know, transition game was going. I scored a lot of fast break points. But Roger Harden, he was following me all over the place. I don't know how many assists that he had into that ballgame, but every spot, everywhere that I went. The ball was right in a position where I could catch and shoot. So I go 11-11 from the field. Had almost 01:18:00the perfect game except for I think I missed about two or three free throws in that game. I should have channeled my inner Kyle Macy and rub my socks and, and probably could have had the perfect game. But needless to say, I think there was somebody a couple years ago that tied the record at that set in terms of going 10 for 10. I think it was Eric Manuel or somebody might have tied the record, but up until that time I was the only guy to play an NCAA tournament game and not miss a shot in the game.

Interviewer: So you were 11-11 from the field. I guess that's what I call being in the zone. How's that feel? Being in the zone, do you--

Walker: I wish I could be in the zone more often, you know. But it is one of those ballgames, probably like The Goose, you know, had an championship game where he banked one in from the corner. You know, every, every shot that you throw up there. It goes in. I mean, the ball is spinning off your your hand, 01:19:00everything you know, just feel good or your energy is positive. You feel like every shot is gonna go in and heard Michael Jordan say "it's just like standing on the ocean and throwing rocks into the ocean." And, you know, everything that you throw up is gonna go in. And obviously it is good to have those game at anytime but to do it in a tournament game with so much on the on the line, I mean, a lot of people still ask me about that game to this day that the Western guy who was calling the game at that time, West Straighter, told me years later that western Kentucky had designed a special defense before the game to stop me. And he said he would talk to that coach after the game that designed this special defense to stop. He said, "well that defense worked pretty good on Kenny tonight. You know, you did a good job."

Interviewer: So you'd mentioned that you'd beaten LSU during the regular season. They did get you then in the tournament by a two-point game. And it seemed like all the games that year against LSU, you guys were within two or three of each other every game.

Walker: Yeah.

Interviewer: Do you recall anything about that last game? Who some of the players on that team were there?

Walker: Yeah, LSU had a really good team. And of course, you and I got a chance to visit with Coach Brown this past summer. And he was reminiscing about some of those games in every game that year like, like he he mentioned to Tyler Hits event in Scott County. Every game was a nip and tuck game. I remember the first game down at LSU, Roger Harden made a 20-25-foot jump shot at the buzzer to to win it at the buzzer at LSU. And then we played them that senior night here in Rupp Arena and that game went down to the wire that we only won it by like six, 01:21:00eight points. And then we knock them off in the SEC tournament in a very close game. So they very well could have won some of those ballgames and of course, the way that it went, I wish they would have probably won one, you know, of those regular season games if we can trade out of one that last game. But what's really ironic, though, about that LSU game, the game before we had to play Alabama for the fourth time and we beat Alabama for the fourth time. So now we're got to play LSU for the fourth time. So, law of averages, you know, just didn't go in our favor. You knew they were going to win at some point. And I remember that ballgame firsthand. I think I scored 22 points in the first half. Boy, I was feeling it, man. I'm thinking, "man, this is gonna be a career night. We're going to go to the final four," and we come on in the second half and Dale Brown the master of the jump defenses. Man, I 01:22:00think he played a triangle or two. I don't know what it was. He. He jumped up the game. They sagged their main guys in on me, they bottled me up. I only scored, I think, two points in the second half. And usually Blackmon, Davender or Roger, they make a couple shots to bring that defense out and it never happened. So we were nip and tuck, back and forth, last two minutes of the game. They had this guy named Rickey Blanton. 6'8 kind of bruiser guy, wasn't really much of a scorer or whatever. Winston always guarded the toughest guy. I think Winston was guarding their superstar player, Aja Williams. And Winston was doing a good job on him. And I had the weakest front court guy because they want to keep me out of foul trouble. So I was guarding Rickey Blanton in the last two minutes of that game. Rickey Blanton, I think scored about six points because I 01:23:00was helping off on defense. And I'm trying to do things-- and he kept going back door. And he was going wild, running down the floor. Go crazy when he was scoring at the end of the game. He probably didn't score six points all year and he scored six points in the last couple minutes. And, you know, that was obviously, you know, heartbreaking, but that was pretty much the difference in the ballgame. They won the ballgame by two points. I remember James Blackmon heeding a shot from half court as time expired to almost send it into overtime. And after the game, Eddie Sutton complained to the media. He complained to the NCAA how unfair it was for us to have to be Alabama fourth time that did have to play LSU for the fourth time. And I think the NCAA, they listened and they changed the rules where you can't put teams, you know, in the same bracket, you know, in the regional finals, you know, they've only been in the final four now. And course that didn't do us any good at that time. It was 01:24:00a nice to know that that we changed the rule for future teams, that that happened, too, but didn't take the sting out of that loss.

Interviewer: That's where the pods came from. Now, you lost that game 59-57 at the buzzer. What are your thoughts?

Walker: Well, Roger--

Interviewer: Knowing your college career is over?

Walker: Well, Roger Harden and I had talked before the game. And Roger is probably the guy that I was closest to at UK for my whole entire career because we came in together. And only thing that we talked about, which is riding out, you know, you know, winning that championship, being seniors and, you know, going out on top. Before we played the LSU game, I remember we'd sit around in our hotel room, me and him, just talking about we're that close to going back to the final four. And we knew that we could beat LSU because we had already done it. I wouldn't say that we were overconfident. We were just 01:25:00knowing that that we're that close to our dream, which just could see it happening, we were confident that we were going to win that ballgame. And when it doesn't happen, you're in shock. I remember, you know, it was kind of ironic situation for me. It was down there at the uh Old Alemany that in Atlanta where the Hawks play and all my family and friends from high school, relatives, everybody, I knew that that ballgame. We all knew that we go-- I remember sitting on the floor for about five minutes after the game. Just a shock. I couldn't believe that we lost my parents were standing behind me and they were sad. And Dale Brown came up to me and said, told my parents, he said, "I know you all are disappointed." He said, "you know, this is one ball game that I hated to win the day." He said, "because this is a great young man." He said, but "he's gonna to make your lives a lot easier to make your real happy by playing in the NBA." And he put his arm around me and gave me a big 01:26:00hug. Gave my mom and dad big hugs. Obviously that makes you feel a little bit better. But knowing that if we would got past LSU, we would have played Louisville in the semifinals with LSU eventually lost to Louisville,.we have beat Louisville early in the year. They had a great player, freshman by the name of Purvis Ellison, who was MVP of the finals and they beat Duke in the championship game. But I felt like if we could get past LSU, we handled Louisville, I think by eight or 10 points in Rupp Arena earlier that year. Felt confident that we could beat Louisville and eventually beat Duke and in the championship game. And, boy that would've been a great way to go out. o beat Louisville in the semifinals and then beat Duke in the championship game. Could have built been a great ending. Wish that it could have happened that way.

Interviewer: Kind of ironic the kid from Georgia finishes his career in Georgia.

Walker: Yeah, that's right. And that's why I say it's kind of ironic because, you know, it all started in Georgia. And then a lot of ways as far as the college basketball career, it ended there. And maybe that was fitting because I think eventually all of the people who wanted me to go to University of Georgia, I think in the end they all understood why went to the University of Kentucky. I had so many people who were the University of Georgia fans say, "Kenny. you know, we really wanted you to go to the University of Georgia. But after the way that your career went, we're glad that you went to the University of Kentucky." So I made a lot of people who are University of Georgia fans, at least they were Kentucky basketball fans, you know, for a little while. And they embraced that part of it. And I think they were generally genuinely happy, you know, for me, because had I played football, it would have been a no brainer. Go to the University of Georgia. I think they understood that I went to 01:28:00the best program when it came to basketball. And it was great to have the support with that.

Interviewer: You finished your career. UK is a 2x All-American, second team in '85, first team consensus in 86, which means everybody voted for you. 2x SEC Player of the Year and 3x all SEC first team. It's got to make you feel pretty good.

Walker: Well, when you look at all of the great players that have played here, I mean, Dan Issel Jamal Mashburn, you know, Jack Givens, Tony Dale, Tayshaun Prince. I mean, even all the way up to the guys now, would, you know, Wall, Anthony Davis and all these guys to still be, you know, sitting in that position in terms of accomplishments, being a second time All-Time leading scorer? I was with Dan Issel and Jack Givens last basketball season, doing an autograph 01:29:00signing and we all laughed and said, "you know what, we're going gonna be at the top of this list for a long time. You know, if these guys keep going, you know, after one year, they'll be wheeling us out of Rupp Arena. We'll be 80, 90 years old, will still be sitting at the top of the scoring list for your career. But it's a great accomplishment because it's such a great program. And you know that you've had so many coaches, players and administrators have been a part of it. And to still be considered, you know, one of the very best to ever lace it up to do it. I mean, that's that's a humbling experience for me. And just like anything else, I think the older you get, the more you appreciate those accomplishments. I think while they're going on, you're just so young and you into the moment, you don't understand what you're doing. But when you've been far removed from it like we have now for about 30 years, I really do appreciate it.

Interviewer: Kenny, why did you put my name on that list? No I'm just kidding. 01:30:00I'm just kidding. Did you all barnstorm after the season?

Walker: Yeah. You know, again, we were the last guys to do it. My senior year was myself, Roger Harden and Leroy Byrd. Leroy, popular player had being only 5'5 so he was a fan favorite and of course Roger and I got a chance to play a lot throughout our careers, so we had a very successful barnstorming deal, unfortunately. You know, they don't get an opportunity to do that anymore because you don't have guys to stay around to for the seniors. But the thing that I really liked about that was it was kind of a farewell tour for the UK fans that maybe never got an opportunity to see you play, to kind of put on a show for one last time. Of course, I would always do a dunk show at halftime of all of the places that we went. And the fans really enjoyed that. So, that was a 01:31:00lot of fun. I was some kind of way they they can get back to that, but I don't know if that would ever happen again.

Interviewer: And explain maybe what the barnstorming I kind of said that, as everybody knows.

Walker: Yeah, well, barnstormers is basically know after you can pick a complete your senior year, you've got to do a tour of the state where you go to play in about 25 or 30 different counties. And basically what you do is you take the seniors from that particular year and we would bring in a lot of the whole former players that have played at UK years before we had in an order to fill out two teams and we would play against each other and put on a good show for the fans. I think the fans, you know, like that kind of support the seniors that were going out. But it was all also an opportunity for them to see guys that they hadn't seen in a long time. I remember that you might have played in a couple games with us. We had Louie Dampier that was still playing a little bit at that time. Larry Stamper, Big Jim Andrews were was still playing. So it was 01:32:00an opportunity for the fans to get a chance to see some of their UK heroes from yesteryear, as well as say goodbye to the seniors. And we always put on a pretty good show, I thought, for the fans. They were competitive ballgame, but you knew that they weren't gonna get out of hand where somebody was gonna get hurt. And it mainly was an opportunity for the seniors to shine. So we had a good time with it.

Interviewer: 1986, then the NBA draft comes along. Did did you did they have you come into New York for the draft or what-- how was that experience like?

Walker: Yeah. They had me come in for the draft. They had about the top, I guess, I guess 10, 15 players, you know, at that time that came in. And it was always projected that after the season was over, I'd interview with a lot of different teams. I actually went to Detroit, Phoenix, the Indiana Pacers and the New York Knicks. I kind of had a feel, you know, some of the teams that were 01:33:00interested and they were all picking very high. Did your favorite? Well, I was I was a little, little bit more leaning towards Phoenix or had a good visit at at Detroit. And then, of course, Indiana, which just so close to Lexington, I thought that would be a good market. However, you know, I think when you're looking to get drafted, you go anywhere you can go in a cause just like anybody else when the Knicks call my name. I'm very excited, you know, to go to New York. Obviously, it's a big challenge. But I didn't know exactly how much pressure it was to play in New York and forgot that Bernard King was the man in New York. And here I was, the guy that was going to be replacing at that time, the reigning NBA scoring champion. He was back to back squad champions before Michael Jordan started to winning scoring championship. So I didn't 01:34:00realize initially just how much pressure was going to be playing in New York. But I learned very quickly with the New York media and the fans and everything, they also that comes with New York. It was a tough place to play and --

Interviewer: How was the the crowd reaction?

Walker: Not good!

Interviewer: You were picked fifth that year.

Walker: I was picked fifth. I think the Knicks crowd was probably wanting a little bit more of a guy like a Len Bias, who was draft the third in that draft. Chuck Person who went fourth to Indiana before I went fifth to the Knicks. I think they were having their hopes that they could get an outside shooter that could kind of do some of the things that Bernard King was doing. And I was more about back to the basket type player. Knicks already had Patrick Ewing obviously at that position. And I think, though, for me personally, when I first went in 01:35:00to the Knicks, I played for about three months for Hugh B. Brown before he was fired. Under Hugh B. Brown. I was averaging about 19 points a game, then about seven rebounds, which was pretty good for a rookie coming in. So got off to a good start, but Hugh B had me posting up more and doing some of the same things that he did with Bernard King. And the offense was kind of going through me a little bit, not as much through Patrick. Course Patrick wasn't happy about that. We weren't doing well as a team. And three months into my rookie year, coach as fired, Hugh B. was fired. And then Bob Hills takes over for the remainder of that that year. And then, of course, you know, things start to change, you know, in my game in the way that he would use me. But it was a constant revolving door in New York, five different coaches for different 01:36:00general managers in the five years that I was there. Right when I got used to one coach, somebody else come in and have you doing something a little differently. I actually played for Pitino my second and third year in New York. Hill finish out the rest of the year. Then he was let go. Then Pitino came into my second and third year and I went from being a starter to a kind of a complimentary guy off the bench because he wanted guys that could shoot the three point shot. But with that being said, I actually made a lot of three pointers where Rick play-- I got a chance to shoot a lot of them coming off the bench and he would encourage me to do it. And it was great. I actually enjoyed playing for him. And until I got a phone call from C.M. Newton and some guys at Kentucky that was inquiring about Rick being the head coach at the University of Kentucky. So Rick eventually left out of my third year in in New York to become the coach at the University of Kentucky so.

Interviewer: Let me go back to that rookie season. Here's a kid from Roberta Georgia. You said population, two stoplights.

Walker: Yeah.

Interviewer: And you're living in New York City.

Walker: Oh, boy. Now, well, the smartest move that I got from some of my veteran teammates, Bill. Bill Cartwright, before we eventually traded him to the Chicago Bulls for Charles Oakley. I was real good friends with Bill Cartwright and a guy named Lewis Ore and Trent Tucker. They all kind of took me under their wings when I came in as a rookie. I relied on those guys from everything. From where to live, where they eat, where to hang out. You know what to do. And I was contemplating living in Manhattan. And the first thing they said, "no, you do not want to live in Manhattan. Either live up in Westchester County or White Plains, which is about 45 minutes north of the city. Little bit more laid back or live out in Jersey. A lot of our guys live down in New Jersey." And the 01:38:00reason being, it was a whole lot less expensive. Not not too much, but it was less expensive to live on places like that. And then you didn't have the temptations of every night, cause something is always going on in the city. They said, "you don't want no part of that. Get away from it."

Interviewer: Just like Roberta?

Walker: Yeah. Just by Roberta, Georgia. It's this like all 2500 people that I knew about that small town. New York was definitely a rude awakening because I thought after experience everything with UK basketball that I mean, New York wouldn't be that big a deal. I felt like I could deal with the media. I've been around a bunch of people. I played in front of big crowds and Rupp Arena. I thought, okay, this won't be that bad, but boy, was I wrong. It is a lot of people, a lot of traffic, a lot of distractions in New York. I'm just happy that this small town kid was able to master it at least for 01:39:00five years without getting any major trouble.

Interviewer: But you mastered it very well. In 1989, you won the slam dunk contest. How did that change, first your career but then also your life?

Walker: Well, that was kind of a bittersweet moment, you know, for me. And I think that whole thing really changed the Knicks fans about who I was and and I think they, that finally put me over the top to get me out of the shadows of Bernard King because I'm not gonna lie. The first couple years, it was tough, you know, to be booed at home by some of your fans. That was really tough. And I really got down on myself, I think, because of that. But you learned that this is New York. They also booed Patrick Ewing. They booed Mark Jackson. They booed everybody. You know, that's just the way that they are. So you learn to have tough skin, you learn to just keep your head down and just 01:40:00keep working. And that's basically what I tried to do. It wasn't until my third year that I actually got in the dunk contest. Patrick Ewing always tried to get me to get in the dunk contest before I actually did. He would see me dunk after the practice and he was like, "man, you should go out to the All-Star Game. You can win the dunk contest." And for my first two years, I would always tell him, "yeah, I'll get into I'll go out. I'll go out there with you and we'll hang out." And then at the last minute, I was like "no, I'm going to Kentucky. I'm taking the weekend off." And so he would get mad. So finally, the third year I decide to do it and we're playing, I guess our final game in Atlanta before the All-Star break, I think it's on a Thursday night and the plan was to play that game in Atlanta. And Patrick and I was gonna fly out to Houston with all star game was. Well, my father was ill leading up to the dunk contest, and he actually passed away the night before we 01:41:00were supposed to play the Hawks on Thursday night. And I was getting ready to get on the bus. And one of my brothers that was to the game got a call from my other brother and said that he had passed away. So we told Patino, who was the coach. And I actually went home to Roberta, which was only about an hour and half away. So I went home and visit with my mother and I wasn't gonna do the dunk contest. It wasn't until I actually talked to her and she said that you got to go out and do the dunk contest tomorrow. And I said, "well, I don't know. So since this happened and maybe I should hang out," she says "there's not a whole lot that you can do here." She said, "we'll take care of everything." She said, "you go out and it'd be a good way to get your mind off of things." She said, "you know, if your dad would have been here, he would've been at home, you know, watching you on TV." So with her blessings, I mean, I decided to go out. And of course, when I get out there, you know, of course, got all of this on my mind generally. You know, dunk contest is supposed to be fun. Get the crowd into it. Man, of course, my focus, which is 01:42:00kind of I got to win this thing. That's what I just kept telling myself. So I guess I was taken it probably a little bit too serious then I probably should have because of the situation, because that's what I wanted to do. So I was focused, you know, going in. And it really helped out that Mark Jackson and Patrick Ewing had made the all star game that year. So they were both out, you know, supporting me. And I remember, Patrick Ewing going around for the dunk contest. He was betting all of these former NBA players who were not involved. "My boy, Kenny Walker's gonna win it. How much you want to bet? You want to bet $50? You wanna bet $100?" He's out there betting everybody and he's having fun. He's come over and put his arm around me. He said, "Sky you go out, you win this thing." He said everything is on me this weekend. "You won't have to worry about everything." And he's all pumped up. And when you look at the videos of the dunk contest, Patrick is in the stands. He's cheering. Mark Jackson is running out on the floor, high fiving. So 01:43:00those guys gave me some inspiration. And it was kind of ironic because it was a good dunk contest. Spud Webb was in there. He was a former defending champion. And of course, it's hard to beat the little guy he was putting on a show and somehow he got knocked out right before the semifinals. And it basically came down to me and Clyde Drexler and Clyde Drexler course he had a great career at the University of Houston, the all star game, it's in Houston. So he's basically in his bag in his backyard, even though he's playing for the Portland Trailblazers. Dominique Wilkins is not in a dunk contest. And Michael Jordan is not in it. So when we get to the finals, I mean, everybody is assuming that this is Clyde Drexler's, you know, dunk contest to win. And I remember, you know, Clyde, we got to the finals and we had three dunks a piece. And Clyde tried to take out from the foul line like Dr. J. And Michael Jordan 01:44:00had did before. And he missed the first one. And at that time, you didn't get a do over. So at that time, you know, I was building momentum as the contest went on. I can't palm the ball because I got real small hands. So I was cuffing the ball. And when you cuff the ball in there, you got to jump even higher. So I had a couple of windmills there in the finals that just the crowd just went, wow. And Clyde actually tried to take off on the foul line twice more. And he missed both of those dunks. And I said that was my father in heaven blocking them out there so he couldn't get them in there. So I ended up winning, you know, the dunk contest and the last dunk that I did, you probably don't remember this, but the last dunk I did was kind of a tribute to Larry Nance. We were playing summer ball back, and this is where I'll give Kyle Macy a lot of credit, I was trying to do some dunk and you showed me a dunk where Larry Nance 01:45:00come from under the basket where he's got the ball cupped and he goes under the backboard is a dunk that the first time I tried it, I think I almost broke my neck cause I could swing it around, and I almost hit my head on the backboard outside. But I kept practicing it that summer. And I remember you telling me, "Larry Nance is the only somebody I'd seen do that dunk," and I've never seen Michael Jordan or anybody else do it. So the last dunk when I knew even if I missed a dunk, I pretty much had the think won. On the last dunk I did, I did that dunk that you told me the re coordination of the Larry Nance dunk for when he was back at his Phoenix days before he got traded to Cleveland.

Interviewer: So I never knew that. And now I can take partial credit--

Walker: Now you can take partial credit--

Interviewer: For two championships and the slam dunk--

Walker: There, there you go. The slam dunk championship. Its all Kyle Macy!

Interviewer: That kind of change your life, too, in the fact that a lot of 01:46:00people, when you're introduced nowadays, they'll know stick in there. 1989 Slam Dunk Champion.

Walker: Well it's it's amazing every years about round I guess All-Star break, which is usually about the second week of February. Man it's amazing how much my phone rings because on the NBA I guess channel and ESPN Classic, they'll do the rerun of the pass slam dunk winners. And of course when you're mention with names like Dr. J., Dominique, Kobe Bryant, Vince Carter, man. Spud Webb, man, those are those are high flyers. So, you know, every year, you know, about round that time, I'm going to get my 15 seconds of fame, you know. So while people call in and say "wow! That a dunk contest." Some people say, it's the greatest dunk contest I ever seen, I think at that time, the way that they were scoring, I got the most points. And in the 01:47:00finals history, I think 50 or two dunks. And I think 49 on the other ones. I think it's the best final score I think that's ever been recorded. So its awesome. You know, Skywalker dunking the, you know, winning the NBA dunk contest, it all goes hand-in-hand. I'd say I'll be an old man walking around on a walker, but I'll still be Skywalker, a lot of folks.

Interviewer: And that was an upset, because if you look back, Spud Webb won in Dallas, where he's from. Michael Jordan won in Chicago where he was playing and Drexler won there in Houston.

Walker: Yes. Yeah. But it's tough. The dunk contest is, I know for a lot of people is there were a future run and jump. You just get out there and dunking. You have fun with it. And I think once you get out there loose enough, that eventually happens. But boy, when you're dunking in a empty gym, it's easy. You know, if you miss a dunk, you know, you can think about that when you're in front of about 18 to 20,000 people and everybody's 01:48:00who's watching you, it's a little bit more difficult to do. I remember on my first dunk in that dunk contest that I won, I wanted to do this windmill where I jumped way up and bring the ball down by my ankle and then come around with, a windmill. Well, I was so nervous when I jumped I didn't come down. I think I might have came down to my waist and it was like it didn't get much reaction out of the fan. And I remember Clyde Drexler coming over to me saying, "Kenny, you got to get your legs moving and do it." He said, "do the dunk that you were doing and warmups." Because we warmed up for about 20 minutes before we actually start dunking. He said "that's what the crowd wants to see." So the guy that I eventually beat in the finals actually gave me some advice. You know, at the first dunk, to kinda loosened up. And I was dunking right out the Spud Webb in that first round, which was really hard because 01:49:00again, he will get a great reaction. So whatever you do, following whatever he does, it better be really good. So I remember going in on my second dunk saying, you know what? I can't wait until the finals to do a good dunk. I've got to bring the house down with this dunk right here. So I remember my second dunk. It was like a 360 when I was spinning in the air while I was spinning in there, tapped the ball of my shoe while I was spinning in the air and then dunking in the basket. And that got a huge reaction not only from the fana, but all the guys, the NBA guys on the front row that wasn't participating. They were all going crazy. So when I saw that reaction, Iwas like, "OK, I'm ready to go right now." So that got me going.

Interviewer: You're out all these different dunks, like, they're just so easy to do. It's amazing to me, though, that you can't palm the ball.

Walker: No, well, that's why I get mad when I shake Rando's hand. You know Rando's only about 6'1 and man. He's got big hands! But you look at all the great dunkers. Dr. J., Scottie Pippen, Michael Jordan, those guys got big hands. I've been watching Murray like in open court. He must have real big hands. He can control that basketball. But I can palm it. But if I go with it, it's going to slip out. It's gonna slip out of my hands. So I just started to kind of cuff the basketball as a way to kinda hold it a little bit better.

Interviewer: As far as your NBA career, it seems like every player at some point they have that moment where they know that they belong in the NBA. Do you recall any particular moment when you say, "I can play at this level"?

Walker: Well, I had a couple of good games. My my freshman year. I know. Scuse me. I had a career high. I think against Chuck Person who I played against in college and I think at that time of 32 points. You know, you remember stuff like 01:51:00that. But I think for me, where I really arrived was probably my third year in the NBA. We planned Boston Celtics, the best three out of five. You know, that's when they used to have those five game series. So we played the first two games in Boston and boy, Larry Bird and them, killed us. And we came back for New York for game three and four, game three. Gerald Wilkins with 15 seconds left on the clock. We we got the basketball after a timeout and the play was drawn up for Gerald Wilkins, kind of like ¼ for set where he was going to go one on one. This is Dominique Wilkins, little brother, and try to beat his guy off the dribble. And the coach said, "Okay, they bring some guy to help you, he rest of you guys just spot up, you know, and be ready for a shot." And I was 01:52:00in the ballgame because Charles Oakley was in foul trouble. I was going back and forth between small forward and power forward. You had Patrick Ewing in one corner I was in another corner. And Kevin McHale helped off defense to try to pick up Gerald Wilkins on the drive. Gerald threw it to me in a corner. Game winner. Win game three of the NBA playoffs to force a game four. And then we win the next game. Patrick goes wild and we go back to Boston for the final game. And we actually won that series in five games on a decisive game on the Boston Garden Home Court, which had never been done. You know, at that time. But it was that game winning shot that cut the series going old. And that probably for me at that time made me felt like; okay. I belong here. I'm doing some good 01:53:00things here. The fans feel good about me. We've won the dunk contests and all of that stuff. So that was pretty good.

Interviewer: After you played there in New York for a while, then you went to Spain, which I didn't even know this that you went to Spain, and played for a year.

Walker: Yeah, I play right when I left New York. Kind of bittersweet feelings and leaving New York. I was the negotiations with the Knicks about returning. Pat Riley was just taking over, talked to Detroit and some other teams. And then out of nowhere, this team out of Barcelona just makes an offer that I can't refuse. Course, you always want to play in the NBA, but at that time it was more of a financial decision for me and it was a good decision because I was able to go over play. Everything was going great. We were having a great season. And then what about. I don't know. I guess couple of weeks left into the 01:54:00season. Ruptured my Achilles tendon. And I said so I ruptured for my Achilles tendon. I didn't even make it the whole year, but I flew back to the states and New York Knicks team doctor did my surgery. I came back here and I rehabed and took about nine months to get myself back together. And I actually went back and played for another team in Spain for about two months just to test my Achilles tendon to see where they were. I helped them make the playoffs and we lost in the second round of the playoffs. But that was good enough to at least get my name. You know, back out there. So I came home for a little while and then there was a team over in Italy that call and said, "hey, we need you to come over and play for about, I guess, eight of 10 ballgames."

Interviewer: Which team was that?

Walker: That was just right after, I guess, that that season in my in Spain.

Interviewer: Which a team in Italy? Do you remember?

Walker: It was a little town called, the team was like Fabiano or something. It about like it was about like two hours like from Rome, Italy or anything else, you know, big city with just a little small country. I played about eight games with them and then they finished up that season. And then the following season, Rex had just got traded from Charlotte to Washington and Rex and the general manager John Nash was really close at that time and me. Rex was really good friends and I finished up over in Italy, I went to visit him in Washington, talked to John Nash about coming to their training camp. You know, that fall the next fall as season was over. So Rex and I played together in Washington, I think was from about '94 to '96 played there.

Interviewer: Yeah you played two years with Washington.

Walker: Played two years with the Washington bullets before they went to the Wizards.

Interviewer: Right.

Walker: You know, a lot of, I guess, stuff happened. I guess they try to be a little bit more politically correct for all of the crime and stuff going on there. Got away from the bullet, but then been good. Well, they weren't too good when there were the bullets, unless you count '78 when and Kevin Grevey was there.

Interviewer: So you finish with the Washington team for two years. But then you go again overseas to Japan. How do you like playing overseas?

Walker: Well, because I was a little bit older I think I was able to deal with it then, you know, being 19 or 20. Coming out of college, when I first played in Spain, in Italy, I had already had the five years in the NBA in New York. And if you can survive New York, I guess you can survive anywhere. But I think it really helped out just being a little bit older. But with that being said, 01:57:00I'm a communication major. So in college, I took some Spanish classes. So it was really helpful when I was in Spain that I could speak broken Spanish and at least to get around to order food or if I got lost or whatever, you know, I can get directions. So that was pretty cool. Same in Italy. Obviously, when you go to Japan, that's a totally different level from what you eat, how do you live, you know, culturally, it's just a whole different deal for me. But with that being said, I was in Kawasaki Japan, which is only about 30 miles from Tokyo. And I think the key to playing overseas is anytime that you're close to a big metropolitan city, you're able to get things that you're accustomed to getting here in the United States, whether it's a newspaper or magazine or watching a movie in English, all the little things that you take for granted, you know, you have those things that can somewhat remind you of 01:58:00home. So outside of missing some sausage and bacon and stuff like that for morning for breakfast, a lot of rice and lot of fish, you know, definitely in Japan. But you learn to find things that you like and you learn to live with it. You know, for the months that you're over there.

Interviewer: I saw when you were in college, one of your teams had an overseas trip. Did you go on that trip?

Walker: Yeah, well, actually, I went after my senior year. You know, that was a trip that it can cause of the timing. When I came in as a freshman, the NCAA rule wouldn't let me go with the team as an incoming freshman. They actually went my freshman year. But I had to stay back. So after my senior year, Eddie Sutton knew that the rule wouldn't let us go as freshmen. So he asked me, Roger Hardy and Leroy Bird. We were all we had already graduated, but he took us on that trip anyway. So then in the plan was, it was the plan was to to not 01:59:00play, just to go over and just hang out and be a part of it. But the team wasn't gelling too good. So we we ended up playing the first couple of games and helped them pull out a couple close wins. And then I think they might even lost one game on that on that trip. But we didn't play.

Interviewer: Do you think that helped you, though, when it came time to go overseas, you felt more comfortable having made that trip?

Walker: Yeah. Yeah. Because you knew a little bit of what it was about. You know, some of the people that we were playing, you know, at that time. Coach Kahalma, you know who. He's been a great friend to Joe B. Hall for so many years. I know what Dwane Casey, and I think Jack might have played over there. Freddy Cowan, you know, so there was that Kentucky connection over in Japan, that Coach Hall had and Coach Kalhalma, who I played for, would Zuzu Motors. I mean, he made several trips over here. Study under Coach Hall and, you know, 02:00:00other coaches and stuff. So to have people like that around that you familiar with, that really helped me out a whole lot.

Interviewer: Think he was over maybe even back when I was playing.

Walker: Yeah he's been around for a while and still involved in some kind of way. I don't know if he's coaching anymore, but still there.

Interviewer: Let's talk a little bit about your post-playing career that you return settled here in Lexington. A radio personality. How'd that get started?

Walker: Well, like I said, I majored in communications. I've always wanted to be involved in some type of way. Know, I've been fortunate, you know, for my playing career here at Kentucky to have some opportunities, to do some things in radio. And Larry Glover, who I've worked with, you know, for years now. Very good friend. Start out Tim Whitburn before he went to St. Lewis, I think that's where he's at right now. But those guys approached me right after I got finished play in my final year in Japan and they approached me 02:01:00about doing a post-game talk show with them. And I said, well, you know, I can dabble into it to have some do. You know, still be around the program. You know, a little bit. And of course, every year that I've done it, you know, since I started, I love every minute of it because it's fun to interact with the fans. It's fun to kind of give them an insight from a former players perspective. And I think they respect that. So I parlayed that into, you know, doing a Friday show with Larry. You know, every Friday in previous years, I've done some stuff with ESPN, started out doing art college basketball segment with them on a show called Cold Pizza that has since been renamed First Take, you know, on ESPN2. They're not doing a college basketball segment anymore. And they said if they if they do decide to bring that back, then might consider bringing me back with something like that. But I, I enjoy being around 02:02:00the game. Absolutely, playing here at the University of Kentucky means a whole lot to me. And to have an opportunity to be on the stage or have a platform where you can, you know, constantly talk to the fans, you know, I love every minute of it. And Coach Cal, it's been great to, you know, let us former players come around the guys a little bit more so we can get to know them on a personal level.

Interviewer: Then after you, you settle back here in Lexington a few years, pass whatever, and you get a phone call, I'm assuming, or someone telling you. But out of fear when you're Jersey number 30, your retired.

Walker: Wow. Boy, that's. That was special. I'll never forget the day that Larry Ivey., who was the athletic director at that time. Of course, when I walk into Rupp Arena, even now, I still look up there because I can't believe that it--

Interviewer: Make sure its there.

Walker: I can't believe that it's actually there. You know, but 02:03:00it's obviously it's a tremendous accomplishment. I mean, when you look at the names of the guys who jerseys hanging from the rafters, you know, they don't put nobodies up there. So you got to you've got to have done something awful good in order to have your name up there. But I think part of having your name and being a part of that elite attorney, you know, I feel like I'm an ambassador for the program. I take great pride in, you know, the things that I was able to accomplish here and the things that I'm able to do now. You know, sometimes just lending your name, you know, to a project or a good cause, you know. You know, bring so much attention to whatever that might be. And to have the power to do that. As a former player, to still be able to make an impact in the communities throughout Kentucky and still have that name and recognition means a lot to me.

Interviewer: Looking back on your career and everything, what are you most proud of?

Walker: Oh, probably from the the the basketball accomplishments are obviously great. You appreciate those memories. But I think I'm most proud of the person that I've been able to the man that I've been able to become. And I think I have a lot of people to thank for that. You know, obviously having a good upbringing and having good parents starts at home. So they definitely did a great job of, you know, raising us as kids. But I think a guy like Coach Hall, who in the recruiting process make me understand, when I was 17, 18 years old, just how special the University of Kentucky was and if things went a certain way, you keep a good name and good reputation how that name and reputation can carry you for the rest of your life. I'm happy that I've been able to handle all of the fame and high expectations and everything, they've been 02:05:00able to come along with it and still be a humble, you know, person in all of this. I think my parents and guys like, you know, Coach Hall, you know, Hugh B. Brown, Rick Pitino, I played for some very good coaches who not only taught you about the game of basketball, but was able to share some things with you to help you become a better man and a better person.

Interviewer: Tell me a little bit about that. Maybe the differences and similarities to playing for Coach Hall, Coach Sutton and Hugh B. Brown.

Walker: Well, the one thing that--

Interviewer: Are they more similar or are there more differences?

Walker: I think they're more similar than than even Rick Pitino, who I played for for a couple years in the NBA. Now, they all have maybe different styles of play in a lot of ways. I wish I could have played for Pitino with the way that he played an up tempo, shooting a three point shot. I think that that would have been fun to do that in college. But Coach Hall was a very good big me 02:06:00coach in terms of teaching the forwards in the centers how to post getting good position. So I learned, you know, those things from him. Eddie Sutton, I mentioned earlier, is a great defensive coach. So they're different from that perspective, but their message is all the same. Have the right attitude. Play hard. Be there for your teammates. Respect your teammates and just play the game to the to the final horn. I think that's what they all say. And then you had the right attitude and the right approach. And you play hard every practice and every game. They were going to be fair to you. Make sure that you got your play time or whatever it was that you were going to try to accomplish. But it was just as important for them to be a good person off the court and carry yourself the right way. And they all preached that. And I'm proud of that.

Interviewer: You seem to have a kind of a special relationship on the court and 02:07:00on about off the court. But you touched on a little better. But you and Roger Harden, how do you describe that relationship?

Walker: Well, we came in together and Roger was a McDonald's all-American like myself. And he didn't play in a McDonald's All-American games. I think he was ill or something. He didn't play. But he was there and he watched me play. And I think I'm by the score about twenty five points, some in the McDonald's all American game, which was in Chicago. And I remember him saying, "man, I can't wait to get Kentucky to play with you, man. You're awesome." So he was he was in my corner from day one. I remember the very first pickup game that I played, Roger and I was on the same team probably a couple days after we both got to Kentucky and we were on a fast break. And Roger threw me a lob pass. It was the most perfect lob pass I think I've ever had. I mean, I didn't have to do anything. It was right there at the basket. And, you know, I just dunked it in. And it was the easiest dunk I think 02:08:00I've ever had. So we we're running down the court. And I was telling him, "you got to throw it higher." And he had this really kind of puzzled look on his face. And then right out there, the game was over. We was taken a breather. We was drinking water. He came up to me. He said, "Walker." He said, "I've never had anybody ask me to throw the ball higher before." He said, "I played with a bunch of 6'4 white dudes and I had to make perfect passes and everything," he said. "But if you want me to throw higher, I throw it higher." So he learned to throw it really higher. But Roger, not being that we came in together, we played all four years together. So Roger knew where I like to catch the ball and the spots on the floor that I like to shoot and everything. He. He knew where I was on the fast break. I mean, it was amazing sometimes that he could throw. No look passes, just knowing that I was gonna be at a certain spot. But it was just chemistry and working together for four years. I still think to 02:09:00this day that Roger, you know, probably one of the most under-appreciated, I guess, guards in the history of UK basketball. It wasn't until John Wall came along, I think a few years ago that Roger Harden single season assist record was broken. I mean, he was a really good point guard. He was a lot of fun to play with.

Interviewer: I'm gonna put you on the spot little bit here, if you don't mind, but you played for Coach Hall through every four years. You have a favorite story about Coach Hall.

Walker: Well, it's is. It is. It is. It is hard to get a good story on Coach Hall. But probably for me, the best one that I could probably recall. But for me personally. Coach Hall really didn't he didn't get on me a whole lot. And he said the reason why he didn't get on me a whole lot was because I practice hard and I had a really good attitude. Guys on the team 02:10:00always said me and Winston was Coach Hall's pet. Well on this one particular day in practice, I guess I wasn't doing what I was supposed to do, I guess it's the one bad day I might have had a bad attitude or something wasn't going right. But man, I just remember I was getting fouled and practice. Rob Locke and Todd Ziegel and Cedriv Jenkins. It was Coach Hall's last year. Every time I went to the basket, they weren't calling the foul and finally I got frustrated and whatever. And and Coach Hall could see it. Then he yelled at me! He yelled at me. "I'm tired of you pouting! You've got to be tougher than that! You've got to do this!" And I said, Okay. He'd never yelled at me before. The very next play, Roger Harden penetrates and I'm coming down the baseline throws a lob pass, man. I go up in a dunk and I've tried to rip the whole basket down and it's shaking. And actually a bolt kind of popped 02:11:00up the back of the backboard. And I look over at Coach Hall, he said, "Okay, that's enough. Practice is over. Let's go, let's get it in." So the one time that he did get on me. I guess he saw the way that I responded. You know, that's the only time that he actually got on me, you know? I guess he was proud of the way that I responded.

Interviewer: How would you or do you think UK fans remember you as a player?

Walker: Probably as a guy that played hard and, you know, that gave it his all. I think the biggest compliment that you can get is when people at 25, 30 years say, "Kenny, you know what I remember about you? You played the game hard." When, we Kidd Gilchrist was here a couple of years ago, so many people will call in and say, "man, that guy reminds me of you." You know, when you were younger, you know, just the energy that that he played with, especially, you know, in my first couple years. Sam Bowie, Melvin Turpin, Jim Masters. Dickie Bill, those 02:12:00guys were the star guys and rightfully so. I just I was just trying to get playing time to do whatever I could to get on the floor. And the only way that you do that is you play hard and you have a good attitude. Fortunately for me, there was some embedded in me by my older brothers and my high school coach. So I was able to do that in the early age. And once you are able to have that type of attitude, it is something that is hard to teach. Either you got it or you don't. I mean, I think that when you got to try to motivate players to play hard, to have the right attitude, something is wrong. You shouldn't have to coach that. This should be something that you bring every night. Attitude and playing at heart. I don't care how many points you score, how many rebounds or how good or bad you play. The one thing that you can do each and every night is lay it on the line. And I think when I talk to fans and people, that seems to 02:13:00be the thing that I remember about me the most.

Interviewer: Is it accurate?

Walker: Well, probably learning that even 95%of the time, I'm quite sure it was probably 5%of the time I gave what Pitino or Calipari say "false hussle". And we made it look good.

Interviewer: Last question. The game's changed a little bit since you play it now. Now this modern game, whatever you want to call it. What's your take on on college basketball today?

Walker: Well, it's a different kind of game. Obviously, when I was in college, you ready to date myself. The shot clock did come in. And to my junior year, the three point shot didn't come in until after my senior year. So I think what the shot clock speeding the game up a whole lot more. And definitely with the three point shot, it has changed the game a whole lot. But when you look at the way that the games are being called right now, even in the NBA, back in my era. It was a more physical game. You were able to really lay wood and in 02:14:00battle in the paint and push and shove it, long, as you know, call it consistent. But now they're trying to clean it up a little bit. They're trying to open the game. I think a little bit more. It's a faster paced game. I think that you've got more versatility, especially at the big land position back when I played, if you're 6, 10, 7 feet tall, you played inside and that was pretty much about it. Now you got, you know, several foot guards that are obviously stuffed away. 20 feet in the basket during three point shot. So I like the way that the game is going. I think that they are constantly trying to clean it up to try to make it less physical. I think it does give the offensive player probably a little bit more balance, because I think fans and people want to see, you know, high scoring. They don't want to see low scoring game. So I think the fact that they're trying to open it 02:15:00up a little bit more is making it a little bit more exciting.

Interviewer: Okay I lied.. One more question.

Walker: Okay.

Interviewer: What are your thoughts on the one and done rule? Because when I look at you and hear and you talk, I mean, you're the perfect example of a player that came in developed through four years. And because of that development moved from maybe a middle like you said, to slower second or third round pick up to number five overall.

Walker: Well, I like it when when the players who can do it obviously make the right decision. You can't argue against a Wall or Cousins or Bledsoe or Carl Townson or any of these guys that we've had to do it here recently. But you can make an argument, you know, for the Daron Lamb or Marcus Teague, you know, or Dan Yorn or Randolph Morris, you know, from a couple years ago. So you got some guys who who are capable of doing it and have proven that they made the right decisions moving on. I think it's hard for these kids to be honest 02:16:00with themselves. They listened to all these, I guess, experts in these mock drafts and everything. And they I think that hurts sometimes more than it help. I have no problem with a player who has the talent and the ability to do it. Those players are rare. You know, LeBron James, Kobe Bryant, some of the guys we've had here recently the problem is every kid think that they're that guy that can do it. I kinda like to see the rules change and to make it at least two years, 20 years old. And I think there's a difference in maturity at 20. Then you have an 18 and 19 years old. And then with two years of college, you at least have some type of idea of what you want to do with life after basketball in case basketball doesn't work out. The problem that you have when these guys leave out the one year, if they don't take care of their 02:17:00money they give up on their education. If they are careless with their money, then they're broke and they don't have anything to show for it. It's almost like I was that for the guys and at least football and basketball, they should almost be forced to take some marketing classes, business classes, finance classes in preparation of what they're going to have to deal with contracts and building a brand and all that stuff. So I think the longer you stay in school, the more you set up yourself a life out after basketball, you'll be all great if these guys took care of their money and they're set up for life at the basketball. I think the sad thing for all of us to see is so many guys within three or four years after their playing career is over, a lot of them are in bad shape financially. So everybody that have stayed in school, guys from our era, even when basketball was over, whether they did good with money or did bad with money, they still have other opportunities because a lot of them was able to get their degree and they are able to 02:18:00transition into something else.

Interviewer: Anything I missed you wanted to talk about?

Walker: I think you, got it. I mean, we covered everything. You know pro college and everything. That's good. Well hopefully that won't bore people a whole lot.

Interviewer: We forgot to turn the camera on. We gotta do it again.