Interview with Stanley Kravetz, September 20, 2016

CRANE: For official purposes, today is September 20th, 2016. My name is Janice Crane and I'm part of the interviewing team for the Jewish Kentucky Oral History Project funded by the Jewish Heritage Fund for Excellence. I'm honored and delighted to be here today with Stanley Kravetz, presently living in Cincinnati. Stanley is family, my second cousin, and one of my all-time favorite relatives who is a special friend to my older brothers. I look forward to hearing Stanley's stories, some memories, and experiences growing up Jewish in Kentucky. Okay, Stanley, what was your full name at birth?

KRAVETZ: Um, Stanley Jack Kravetz.

CRANE: And will you spell Kravetz for me, 'cause sometimes I see it with an E and sometimes I see it with an I.

KRAVETZ: K-r-a-v-e-t-z.

CRANE: When and where were you born?

KRAVETZ: I was born in Georgetown, Kentucky, 1934, March the 4th.

CRANE: I know that both of your parents have passed away, but for the record and because they are part of your story, what were their names and about when and where were they born?

KRAVETZ: Okay. My father was born in Lithuania. There were not birth certificates or any kind of, um, certificates pertaining to their births. So basically, we gave him a birthdate of January the 1st, 1900. So that's an arbitrary number because, uh, no one really knows. And my mother was born in Lithuania and, um, she was born in 19--I think about 1915, and, um, and they 00:02:00both were refugees. They came to, uh, the US. My mother was able to get into Ellis Island, but my father--although he had papers and the necessary items to get here, to get in here--they would not let him in. So, he went up to Canada. Canada took him, and, um, he said that it was a holiday of some sort--he didn't know what it was--and a lot of people were going back and forth from Windsor on the bridge, just walking. So, he said he got in with a group of people and just walked right into the country.

CRANE: Hmm.

KRAVETZ: So, um--and my father was born in Lithuania also.

CRANE: Uh, what were their names at--uh, when they were born? What was your mother's name?

KRAVETZ: Rose; R-o-s-e. My father was Isaac.

CRANE: Do you remember--what was your, your mother's maiden name?

KRAVETZ: Applebaum.

CRANE: Applebaum. Okay. And of course you have siblings. What are their names and ages relative to you?

KRAVETZ: Uh, the eldest is Andrea Kravetz. She's fifty-five. Uh, Pam Kravetz is uh, fifty-three. Uh, Scott Kravetz is--just had a birthday. He's fifty. And I have twins, uh, they were, um, let's see, they--their ages, forty-five. It's Kim and Todd. They're twins.

CRANE: And Kim passed away, uh, less than two years ago?

KRAVETZ: Yes. A year and a half ago.

CRANE: Okay. Those are your children.

KRAVETZ: Right.

CRANE: What were your siblings?

KRAVETZ: Okay. My siblings was, um, Sandra or Shanee, and, uh, her age is seventy--I think seventy. And, uh, Faye. Faye, I think she's about seventy-five.

CRANE: Okay. I know you're married and I'm sorry I'm missing getting to see her. Um, but what was your--is your wife's full name?

KRAVETZ: Um, Reenie Kravetz.

CRANE: What was her maiden name?

KRAVETZ: Her maiden name was Shuman.

CRANE: Shuman?

KRAVETZ: S-h-u-m-a-n. Shuman.

CRANE: Okay. And where was she--is she from?

KRAVETZ: Here, at Cincinnati. She was born in Cincinnati.

CRANE: And when did you get married.

KRAVETZ: We got married, let's see--

CRANE: This is a test.

KRAVETZ: Forty-six years ago. Let me see, forty-six years ago from now. I hate to be, um, evasive.

CRANE: That's okay.

KRAVETZ: What's forty-six from two-o-one-six? Forty-six, zero--

CRANE: That's okay.

KRAVETZ: Uh, 1970.

CRANE: Okay. And you were married before Reenie, and you were widowed. Again for the record, what was your first wife's full name?

KRAVETZ: Uh, Norma-Jean, uh, Kravetz of course. Her maiden name was Marcus (??).

CRANE: Marcus. Okay. Um, someday your grandchildren are going to have a homework assignment to share their family history, and they will really appreciate how easy you're making this for them. So will you please tell me the 00:06:00names and ages of your grandchildren?

KRAVETZ: Uh, I have--the eldest, uh, live in Kentucky, and um, they're sixteen. That's Bella and, uh, let's see, fourteen is Joey, and, uh, twelve is Karma, and their made--their name is Bryan, B-r-y-a-n.

CRANE: Okay.

KRAVETZ: Then, uh, let's see, I have Max Weldonhouse. He's just twenty-two. And, let's see--there's so many of them--um--

CRANE: A lucky man.

KRAVETZ: Yeah I am. I feel very fortunate. Uh, they all live, live, uh, 00:07:00basically right around here. And then there's Noah Kravetz. He is gonna be five. And his sister is, um, Zera (??). She was named after--after Kim. And, um, she is going to be one year old. And I think that covers everybody.

CRANE: Okay. I know your paternal grandmother's name was Sarita (??) or Sara (??).

KRAVETZ: Right.

CRANE: She was my great-aunt, and at some point lived in Europe, and she perhaps owned or operated a hotel. I heard stories about that. And maybe came from Pušalotas [Pushalot], the same shtetl in Lithuania where so many other older Kentucky Jewish families had their roots. What do you know or remember about your grandparents?

KRAVETZ: The--(clears throat)--not a great deal. Um, my grandfather's name was 00:08:00Nathan Kravetz and he was a blacksmith. And uh, the way that they survived--and as your mother told me also, Martha Steinberg--the way they survived in Lithuania was that my grandfather--like I said, was a blacksmith. He was, um, a blacksmith to the czar and he made the wagon wheels for the czar's wagons. And, um, basically that's how they survived; because he had a decent job. Otherwise, uh, it was a very difficult life there. A very hard life. And, um, my father helped him in the blacksmith shop. So, uh--

CRANE: So when our families left, left Lithuania in their covered wagons and 00:09:00went and had tea at the czar's place, it was your grandfathers that let them in?

KRAVETZ: Yes. He was--he was the instrument in, uh, in their survival, and you know, in all--all things that happened there.

CRANE: Wow. Okay, Stanley, you're presently living in Cincinnati but I know that you once lived in Kentucky. You were born in Georgetown.

KRAVETZ: Georgetown. Um-hm.

CRANE: Where in Kentucky did you live? Did you live only in Georgetown or did you live other places, and when was this?

KRAVETZ: Well--(clears throat)--when I was born we lived in Sadieville. We had a farm in Sadieville. And, um, then we moved to Georgetown, Kentucky. And uh, 00:10:00we were the only Jews that lived there at that time. Well even now--(laughs)--I imagine. I don't know if there's any there now. So, we were the only Jews that were there, and they had a little difficulty getting accepted. People had preconceived ideas about Jews, and, uh, it was difficult. You know, I had problems at school, uh, I had to defend myself, fight my way home almost every day. And, uh, I know my third grade teacher, Miss Carry, she would let me out twenty minutes early so I could--(laughs)--beat the crowd going home, because we all walked. There was no buses then. But that only lasted for a few years and after that I was--it was just wonderful. I was very--I was accepted. Um, I was 00:11:00voted, um, the king of the, uh, of the class, when they had the king and queen, uh, voting. And, uh, so it goes to show you, you know, that, you know, people have preconceived ideas, but when you show them what you are, uh, sometimes it, uh, works out for everybody.

CRANE: So was that in Sadieville or Georgetown?

KRAVETZ: Georgetown.

CRANE: What brought your family to Kentucky?

KRAVETZ: Well, my father--when he came here about 1918--he was--he was actually in the Russian Army and, uh, his, his brother was already here. So his brother got passage for him to, um, to come to this country, and, um, he--like I said, 00:12:00he was in the Russian Army. I assume it was for White Russia because he worked for the czar, but--and, uh, he just, uh--(laughs)--he just left. He took the uniform off and left, and got on--got on the ship. His brother paid passage for an upper deck, but when he put all these people in they threw them all in the bottom. And he said it was very, very tough there. Some people died. There was very little food if anything, and very little water, and it was a rough trip. So, uh--and then he came into Canada.

CRANE: And how'd he end up in Kentucky?

KRAVETZ: Oh. Oh, his brother had a farm in Kentucky.

CRANE: And what was his brother's name?

KRAVETZ: Robert. And, um, when my father came here he went to Kentucky. He 00:13:00carried a pack on his back. He went through the country there, hill country, uh, I think it was selling underwear and socks and things like that. Couldn't speak English. But, uh, he did that and, uh, then he got some money and he bought a farm. And, uh, so basically his brother was there, had a farm, and then my father came right in also.

CRANE: So, was your Uncle Robert's farm also in Scott County?

KRAVETZ: Yes.

CRANE: And how close were the two farms?

KRAVETZ: I would say a matter of three or four miles apart.

CRANE: How big were they?

KRAVETZ: My father's farm was 360 acres. Robert's farm, I don't know. I don't know.

CRANE: So what were the occupations of your parents? After he bought the farm, 00:14:00I assume at some point he quit peddling his wares on his back.

KRAVETZ: Yeah, he quit that and then he started farming. Uh, my mother lived in Cincinnati, that's where he met her, although they lived in the same part of the country but they never knew each other. She was from Shutomer (??) and they were from Pušalotas, which I understand doesn't really exist anymore, that the Germans destroyed everything, and of course and they annihilated all the Jews. Um, my mother worked in Cincinnati for a book binder, and, uh, my father farmed.

CRANE: What did he--what did he grow? Or what kind of farmer was he?

KRAVETZ: Okay, it was a dairy farm, basically. It's hill country so you can't grow a lot of things on hills, but we had--we had some flatland, the bottoms, 00:15:00near the creek. Uh, grow a little corn down there. We had--we had at one time a twenty-five, twenty-six acre tobacco base and that was the main crop. And, uh, of course the government kept cutting back the base. Uh, but they had a--they had a guarantee of what your tobacco would sell for per pound, and if it didn't reach that at the auctions in Lexington, then the government would pay the difference. So, they kept cutting your base back, and, uh, at the dairy farm, like I said, a tobacco base was the main cash, cash crop. And, uh, I forget about how many cows he must have had. Probably around fifty, I imagine. We had two like dairies on, on our farm. And, uh, the milk was taken to 00:16:00Lexington, Sealtest bought the milk. And, uh, other than that, there wasn't a lot of farming. Like I said, the land was not, not real good, so we had a small corn crop down by the creek--it was flat down there--and, uh, the tobacco. And then of course they kept whittling away the tobacco until eventually there was very little of it, of the tobacco base; that meant what you were allowed to grow.

CRANE: So was this an electronic milking, or did--was this--

KRAVETZ: At first it was not. They'd get up three in the morning, he and Bryant Wright (??), who worked with my father--for my father. Uh, they'd get up like three in the morning and milk the cows by hand, and if you've ever milked a cow by hand, uh, it's not an easy, easy job. So, uh, anyway, you milk them 00:17:00twice, twice a day; in the morning and then late in the day, and then my father'd get the milk and, and run it into Lexington.

CRANE: On a daily basis?

KRAVETZ: Yeah. Yeah, you have to. There was no refrigeration then.

CRANE: Oh.

KRAVETZ: But, later on, we got electric. The, uh--we had electric milkers and refrigeration. So it made life a lot easier. But the house that we lived in had no elec--there was no electricity in the area. Uh, no water, no plumbing, uh, no phone. So, it was--it was just basic life. It was--it was a tough life.

CRANE: How long did it take you to get to Lexington then?

KRAVETZ: Well we used to go on US-25. It's a two-lane highway. Um, from, from 00:18:00Sadieville to Lexington, about eighteen miles to Georgetown and another twelve miles to Lexington, what's that thirty miles? Uh, you might average thirty miles an hour in those days, so that's what it was. It was a seven-day-a-week job.

CRANE: So it was an hour to Lexington.

KRAVETZ: At least. CRANE: And an hour back?

KRAVETZ: Oh, yeah. At least an hour to Lexington from Sadieville.

CRANE: How did your parents' business, the dairy farm, connect with other Jewish farmers or merchants or business, or were there other--?

KRAVETZ: To my knowledge there were no other Jewish farmers in the area. Uh, most of the Jews, um, lived in Georgetown, Lexington. Uh, they were merchants 00:19:00for the most part, dry goods, um, that's, that's what most of them were. They had these small little family, uh, dry goods stores.

CRANE: How would you describe your parents' relationship to Judaism?

KRAVETZ: My father was very religious. Um, he abided by the dietary laws and, um, we, um, we come--we'd go to Cincinnati about, I don't know, three or four times a year, and pick up, you know, bread, um, and, um, the chickens that we raised were taken to Lexington, and there was, um, Mr. Goller, who was a 00:20:00shochet. A shochet is a person who is ordained to slaughter, so he would, uh, slaughter the chickens. That's--was our mainstay. Uh, and, uh, then we'd take them home and pick them, and like I said, there's no refrigeration. You'd get an ice box or something that would preserve, but you couldn't, uh, store a lot of perishable items. And, um, of course we couldn't buy it in the stores because it wasn't, wasn't a kosher product. So, uh, that's just all part of life.

CRANE: What was it like watching, or--Mr. Goller kill your chickens?

KRAVETZ: (laughs) That's a tough term you got there. Um, it--um, it was--it 00:21:00was tough to see how life is, you know, even for an animal. And, um, it's supposed to be humane, but, you know, it's, uh, the procedure is quite grotesque, as all slaughter is. So it's not just kosher slaughter, it's all ----------(??). That's why you have a great deal of vegetarians now; because they don't like the, the way animals are, are kept, and of course slaughtered.

CRANE: So what did he do?

KRAVETZ: I didn't know you wanted to know all of that. Well, he had a ritual knife that--kept in a box.

CRANE: --oh--

KRAVETZ: And, uh, he would say a prayer before he slit the throat of the chicken. Uh, you--he would bend the head back and slit the throat, and then the 00:22:00legs would be tied. And there was a barrel in the garage and you put the broom handle through the legs and let the chicken lay--hang in there until it perished. Some of them lived a long time.

CRANE: Even after they slit?

KRAVETZ: Um-hm.

CRANE: Oh wow. So the slitting of the throat didn't automatically kill the--

KRAVETZ: Well, def--definitely--yeah, yeah, not necessarily all of them, but you--the kosher procedure is that you--that you do not drink blood. You do not eat the blood or drink the blood. That's why the throat is slit and then the chicken is hung in a barrel until it, you know, expires, and drains.

CRANE: What was Judaism in your home like growing up?

KRAVETZ: Well, my parents were basically Orthodox so it was--it was a very, um, oh, I don't know, a lot of the kids went out on Friday nights and Saturdays and we weren't--and we didn't, because it's a--it's, you know, it's the Sabbath. So, it was just a little strict, but it was okay. You--you grew up that way.

CRANE: How did your family celebrate the Jewish holidays and Shabbat when you were young?

KRAVETZ: Oh, the Jewish holidays we came to Cincinnati, and, uh, we would stay here during the holidays, and, um, then we would go back home. Uh, that was a 00:24:00trip to come to Cincinnati, 'cause here again, it was US-25, and that was a two-lane highway and it took half a day to get here. So it wasn't a pleasant trip.

CRANE: So--

KRAVETZ: And we, uh, we had a pick-up truck. We never did have a car on the farm, so, uh, there was five of us; three, three children, a mother and father. So I usually sat in the back of the truck and, uh, the girls and my parents sat in the front. And, uh, it was a different kind of a trip from, from now--from how things are now.

CRANE: So, for the holidays you all went to Cincinnati instead of coming to Lexington?

KRAVETZ: Yeah. Yeah.

CRANE: Did your family have any affiliation with the synagogue in Lexington?

KRAVETZ: I was bar mitzvahed there when I was thirteen. Uh, that's--as far as I know, that's the only affiliation.

CRANE: Where did you go to Hebrew school and Sunday school?

KRAVETZ: My father taught me my bar mitzvah, and, uh, I didn't go to any, any schools.

CRANE: On the Ohavay Zion Synagogue Web site, there's a list of founders, and among those listed are several Kravetzes.

KRAVETZ: Okay.

CRANE: There's a B. Kravetz, a Beryl Kravetz, a Lewis Kravetz (??), and N. Kravetz, and a Robert Kravetz. Are you related to any of these men, and--

KRAVETZ: Robert Kravetz.

CRANE: Was your uncle?

KRAVETZ: Uncle. Right.

CRANE: Okay. And N. Kravetz?

KRAVETZ: I--I--I doesn't ring a bell.

CRANE: Was your grandfather's--a Nathan Kravetz?

KRAVETZ: Nathan, yes.

CRANE: But did he ever come to America?

KRAVETZ: Oh, yeah. Yeah.

CRANE: Okay. So that could have been Nathan Kravetz?

KRAVETZ: I don't--it could have been, but to my knowledge, uh, they--they land--they landed in Cincinnati.

CRANE: Okay.

KRAVETZ: And I see no reason why they would have gone to Lexington.

CRANE: Okay.

KRAVETZ: But, you know, I don't know. Possibly.

CRANE: How did living in Scott County, Georgetown, affect your family's affiliation with the Jewish communities in either Lexington or Cincinnati?

KRAVETZ: I don't think there's any real, uh, affiliation, other than--there're no synagogues there or any religious, uh, organization. You know, there's really nothing in--in Georgetown that we--all the religious, uh, affiliation was 00:27:00in Cincinnati. We had family here, and, uh--

CRANE: And did you have family in central Kentucky, and how were you related to the families in central Kentucky?

KRAVETZ: Okay. We had, uh, Steinbergs, which you're--

CRANE: Right.

KRAVETZ: --part of. See, the Greens in Winchester, uh, the Levys in Lexington. I'm thinking. I really don't know for sure where they lived, but I think that was--that was the extent of the families that we were with.

CRANE: Okay. In my research on you, I found that--what I believe is a picture 00:28:00of you from 1950 at Garth High School in Scott County.

KRAVETZ: That's right.

CRANE: That is where you went to high school?

KRAVETZ: Yes.

CRANE: Okay. What was it like as a Jew growing up and attending school in what was, at that time, rural Kentucky?

KRAVETZ: Well, like I said, uh, my first experience at, at --in school at Garth was not real pleasant because, uh, I was a Jew and, uh, everyone knew it. But you know, after, after people or students or kids saw what we were--my sisters went there. Faye and Shanee went there, and I did, and after, after about I guess the third or fourth grade, everything was perfect. There was not a 00:29:00problem. But initially there were big problems. The, uh--the older people thought the Jews had horns and things of that nature. When they--(laughs)--when they saw that we didn't, then things got better.

CRANE: When did your family move to Cincinnati?

KRAVETZ: Hmm, let me get my paper here and we'll see. Um, let's see it was seventeenth, eighteen--

CRANE: You graduated from high school in Scott County, right?

KRAVETZ: No. I graduated, um, my last two years--my junior and senior year, 00:30:00um, we were in Cincinnati and I graduated from Hughes High.

CRANE: Okay. What did your family teach you about Judaism, and how did what you learned in growing up Jewish impact the choices you made in life?

KRAVETZ: Well, growing up in--in a--in a very rural area, uh, you soon learn that, you know, you're, you're different, and, uh, you, you have different beliefs, and, um, being a Jew is good. Uh, I wouldn't have it any other way. But still, you know, other religions are fine, too, but, uh, this is the one for 00:31:00me. But I've found that--or, we have found that--Christians is who we grew up with. They're fine, fine people. Uh, in Georgetown where we lived, our neighbors were the best people in the world. Uh, they're--it was just a very close-knit community, being Jew or not, you know, after the initial breaking-in period. And, uh, we, we enjoyed--like I said, my mother says it's the best years of her life when she was on the farm, and she was a country girl. And our farm was very, uh, very, very basic.

CRANE: What is your most vivid memory of Jewish life and ritual growing up?

KRAVETZ: Well, when, when you're thirteen you become bar mitzvahed or a man, and, uh, my--we--my father was a very religious man. He knew, uh, the Jewish religion quite well, and he, he taught me, uh, my bar mitzvah and, uh, we had no other way to go as far as learning anything, but, um, he was very well versed in Judaism. A very, very gentle man and a very good man.

CRANE: What was your bar mitzvah like?

KRAVETZ: I remember it was on, uh, Maxwell Street where the synagogue was. Now I think it's a restaurant or something. I don't know. But anyhow, um, we, uh, 00:33:00you know, the Jewish community in Lexington was, was there, and, uh, you have to have a new suit, which I had. It was a blue herringbone wool. It had to be wool, otherwise it wasn't satisfactory. And that thing was a monster. In those days wool was wool and it would eat you up. So anyhow, um--and then my mother and I think your mother and one or two other people, we would have, um, a get-together after the bar mitzvah, and, uh, the mainstay was corned beef sandwiches. That's what everybody enjoyed because they were so hard to get. So, it was basically corned beef sandwiches, strudel, and, uh, RC Cola and 00:34:00things like that.

CRANE: And did you lead the whole service or did you just do--

KRAVETZ: No. I just did what we call the haftarah--the maftir, the haftarah. Nowadays the kids do the whole thing. Most of them do--

CRANE: Do you remember what your haftarah was?

KRAVETZ: ----------(??)

CRANE: I can always ask you to do a few lines.

KRAVETZ: (laughs) Are you kidding? When that day was over, then that was it.

CRANE: Before we get into your college and adult life, is there anything else unique--that you would like to share, or that we should know, about your family background or your childhood years? Stories that your parents told you, um--

KRAVETZ: Well, the, the stories that my, my father had and my mother's told is from the old country, and they weren't nice stories. They were--I know years 00:35:00later I'd ask my father, "Do you speak Russian?" He said, "No." He said because the shtetl--was the place where, where the people lived--they weren't allowed out at night, and they would come and lock them in and they had very little--they had gates that they closed up and the Jews were all, so to speak, locked in for the night. They had very little, uh, association with the--with the Lithuanians or the Russians, at that time, and, uh, they spoke Yiddish. And all the Jews spoke Yiddish. Most of them didn't know--knew very little or any Russian, although that was the language, and, um, they had--they had their 00:36:00conversations in Yiddish, which is a, a dying language, but it's a great language. It's a language of all different countries that Jews were in, and, uh--

CRANE: Do you speak, uh, Yiddish?

KRAVETZ: Some, yeah. Do you? Yeah, it's--

CRANE: --I only know the bad words.

KRAVETZ: Oh, well those are easy ones. Oh, yeah, yeah. Reenie, my wife, she speaks Yiddish. Like I said, it's too bad, it's just a dying language. It's, it's a great language.

CRANE: Okay. Let's move on to the University of Kentucky. I know that you went to the University of Kentucky.

KRAVETZ: Yes.

CRANE: What years were you there, and why did you choose U.K.?

KRAVETZ: Well, the reason I chose U.K. is that, uh, we had property in Kentucky 00:37:00and, uh, I just wanted to go and, uh, I knew more people in Kentucky than I did here. I was only here for two years and I didn't know a lot of people. And, uh, I just liked it there. I still do.

CRANE: What years were you there?

KRAVETZ: God, I'm trying to think. Um, I went there 1950--I think 1950, I believe.

CRANE: Okay. Describe your living accommodations while you were at U.K.

KRAVETZ: Okay. Uh, when I first went there, I lived in the--what they call the 00:38:00barracks. It was, um--used to be army barracks at one time. And, uh, I lived there. It was on--I can't think of the street, but they had the tobacco warehouses right across the street from where the barracks were, that we lived, and that's where they held the tobacco auctions. Every, every fall the big tobacco companies would come in and bid on your tobacco. Then after, after a year or so of that, I went to live with my--with my aunt--uh, cousin, Martha Steinberg on Fontana Avenue, and, uh, that was, uh, a great time in my life to live there.

CRANE: It was at that. Tell me about your social life as a college student.

KRAVETZ: Um, I had very little social life, uh, as, as a student at the university. I--I worked after school and, uh--

CRANE: Where did you work, Stanley?

KRAVETZ: I worked for your father, uh, Irving Steinberg, in the jewelry store.

CRANE: Oh.

KRAVETZ: And, uh, that was great. A great man. Irving Steinberg, a tiny jewelry store, and it was a great place. And that's where I spent my time when I wasn't in school and I enjoyed it immensely.

CRANE: Describe any involvement you had with the Jewish organizations on campus such as a Jewish fraternity or Hillel.

KRAVETZ: Uh, I don't know (??). Hillel was very active when I was there. I don't remember it anyway. But, uh, Sidney Steinberg was instrumental in getting an organization together for the Jewish kids and I participated in that, and I don't remember exactly now what it was called, but, uh, Sidney started an organization there for Jewish kids.

CRANE: Sidney did?

KRAVETZ: Um-hm.

CRANE: According to the Z.B.T. list, it says you were a 1954 pledge of the Z.B.T. class. Is that possible?

KRAVETZ: Well, I won't contradict it but I don't recall it.

CRANE: Is it possible there's another Stanley Kravetz?

KRAVETZ: No. No, that's not possible.

CRANE: It was, um--in your Z.B.T. class, it included Billy Golton (??) and Jack Miller. Those are two names that I knew of.

KRAVETZ: I don't recall. It's been a long time. I don't know. (laughs)

CRANE: So what was the organization that my brother got you involved in?

KRAVETZ: Well, it wasn't a fraternity or anything, it's just that it was an alternative to what was available. Uh, I assume Z.B.T. was. I don't know--I don't know if there's any other one. It was just a--a group, and, uh, and we just, um, you know, got together. It was just, uh, like a friend thing.

CRANE: Where did you all gather?

KRAVETZ: As far as I can remember, at the--oh, the big building there 00:42:00where--the union--was it a union? Was it called that then?

CRANE: The student union?

KRAVETZ: The student union. Was that--I don't know if it was called that, but that's what it was. It was just a communal, uh, building.

CRANE: And these were other Jewish students?

KRAVETZ: Yeah. Yeah.

CRANE: And what kinds of things did you do?

KRAVETZ: Well, it disbanded after about a year, so, uh, we really didn't do much of anything. It never really got off the ground.

CRANE: Did you--do you remember anybody else that you were in it with?

KRAVETZ: No, just, just Sidney.

CRANE: Just the two of you.

KRAVETZ: It was an organization of two. But th--there were others, but I, I 00:43:00just don't recall.

CRANE: Do you remember Billy Golton?

KRAVETZ: Yeah, I remember the name.

CRANE: Do you remember him on campus?

KRAVETZ: Not really. I went to agriculture and there weren't any Jews in it--the College of Agriculture.

CRANE: Is that because you came from the farming community?

KRAVETZ: Yeah. I thought at one time that I would continue, uh, the farming, but, um, it wasn't for me.

CRANE: What were Jewish holidays like when you were on--at the university? How did you celebrate holidays?

KRAVETZ: Well of course, you know, going back, back home, uh, my parents lived in Cincinnati, so I would, uh, I'd go back to Cincinnati to celebrate.

CRANE: So did you date Jewish girls on campus, and if so, how did you meet them?

KRAVETZ: I don't know of any. (laughs) There were very few Jews there. I didn't know of any. I had a sweetheart here.

CRANE: In Cincinnati?

KRAVETZ: Yeah,

CRANE: I see.

KRAVETZ: Which I married.

CRANE: Describe a day in your life as a college student; what did you do, where did you go?

KRAVETZ: Well, I went to classes, of course. That's what you're there for. And, um, that took up most of the day. And like I said, generally after school or on the weekends I would--I would go to work at the, uh, the jewelry store. So, that was my life with just the classes and then, uh, working.

CRANE: Did you continue to keep kosher?

KRAVETZ: Oh yes. Yes, definitely. Even--

CRANE: And--

KRAVETZ: --when I was in the military.

CRANE: When were you in the military?

KRAVETZ: Sixty--six--1960? Oh yeah, we, uh--I was, uh--and my son, Scott, 00:45:00also. He was in the military--not at that time, of course, but--and, um, he kept kosher. There were kosher meals available to him at that time. Uh, they had what they call M.R.E.s; Meals Ready to Eat, and, uh, you could get them then. When I was in, you know, they basically would give you milk and ice cream, all you could eat. Bread, potatoes. So I had plenty to eat.

CRANE: Describe the climate on campus when you were there for Jews becoming members of non-Jewish fraternities.

KRAVETZ: To my knowledge, none of that existed. I don't think--there were that--there weren't that many Jews, I don't think, that attended then, and if there were, I don't know of anyone pledging non-Jewish fraternities. I mean, I 00:46:00don't know of that.

CRANE: Were there any Jewish sororities on campus? That you're aware of?

KRAVETZ: Not that I can recall, no. Nope. Like I--the Jewish population, at that time, I don't think was very strong.

CRANE: Did--as, um, a Jewish student on campus, did you have a connection with the comm--the larger Lexington Jewish community? Did you go to services there, um, on Maxwell Street at the synagogue?

KRAVETZ: Yeah, I did. I did occasionally. Occasionally I would go to the synagogue on Maxwell Street.

CRANE: How did your time at U.K. impact your Jewish identity?

KRAVETZ: I don't think it had a lot to do with, uh, with my identity as a Jew, 00:47:00going to the school. Uh, I don't--I don't think it had any real impact. I met a lot of non-Jewish--I had a lot of non-Jewish friends at school, but eh, it didn't really have any impact.

CRANE: So what was your life after college?

KRAVETZ: Well, I went to--I went into the army, uh, and then after that I, uh, got married. And, uh, at that time, uh, my wife was a school teacher and I had a couple of optical shops in the area, Cincinnati area. I was an optician. I 00:48:00had a Kentucky license, which was very rare in those days; there weren't many Kentucky opticians. But all those were licensed occupations. And, um, you know, just extended from, from that.

CRANE: What was Judaism in your home like as an adult or parent?

KRAVETZ: We kept kosher. Uh, we weren't Orthodox. I did not really, um, like or agree with the Orthodox way. But we kept kosher. My wife lit candles on Friday night, and, uh, we went to a lot of Jewish organization little things. So, you know, everything except for the, uh, extreme Orthodox, which we didn't do.

CRANE: How was your practicing Judaism different than that of your parents?

KRAVETZ: Well, my parents were Orthodox and I--Orthodox just wasn't for me. I wasn't that strict. So, it was quite different. It was quite different. When I got out on my own, I, uh--like I said, we kept--we kept the holidays, we kept, uh, kosher in the house, and even going out; we didn't eat meat or anything of that nature. So, you know, it was, uh--we were, you know, Jewish without a doubt, but just not Orthodox, not to the, uh, to the extent of being an Orthodox Jew.

CRANE: What are some of the examples of the--of how your parents were that you weren't in Orthodoxy?

KRAVETZ: Okay. My parents--and of course I lived with them--we didn't--we 00:50:00didn't drive on Friday night or Saturday, and, uh, we didn't turn lights off and on. My mother would leave a small light on--on the gas range or stove to warm things up for Saturday. Um, we, uh, didn't go anywhere except to the synagogue. We used to go to the synagogue, and of course Jewish friends would come over every Saturday. We had a lot of Jewish friends and family that would stop in, in the house, and my mother always had a lot of stuff prepared. And other than that, you know, we--I observed all of that except for the fact of not going anywhere on Friday night or Saturday. Um--

CRANE: As a parent, what were the holidays like in your home for your children?

KRAVETZ: As me being a parent?

CRANE: Um-hm. How did you celebrate the holidays?

KRAVETZ: Well, we celebrated the holidays. You--I didn't have a strict code or anything. Uh, we celebrated them; we went to synagogue and we ate the traditional, uh, Jewish things on those holidays. And, uh, it was good. It was very joyous, you know, it just wasn't real strict.

CRANE: How has your Judaism changed over time?

KRAVETZ: Well, I guess I'm not as--not quite as religious as I used to be, uh, only in the sense of going to the synagogue on Friday night and Saturday. 00:52:00That's very occasional now; I don't do that all the time. We do go for the holidays. We observe the holidays and go to the synagogue for those and belong to a synagogue. But, uh, it hasn't gotten stronger--it really hasn't gotten any weaker, but, uh, I just don't believe as deeply as I did. Uh, things have happened in my life that, uh, makes you think about, uh, about life and of course religion enters into that. You know, the fact that six million Jews were exterminated in the thirties and forties, it--it makes--it makes you question, 00:53:00regardless of what religion you are, it just makes you question your faith in hum--you know, in religion. But, I'm still religious and I will be until the curtain comes down.

CRANE: How do you feel about Zionism? What role does Israel have in your life?

KRAVETZ: Um, I'm very, very strong for Israel. Um, as my father said, uh, "Don't ever think that it can't happen here." He was referring to the Holocaust. He, uh, he felt very strongly because he came from a country where they would periodically come through and kill you, burn your house and, and, and kill you, in Lithuania and all parts of Russia if you were Jewish. So, uh, I 00:54:00feel very strong about Israel. I--we contribute and, uh, it--to me, it's the last resort. If things happen to the Jews, as, as--if, if you read the papers, uh, the, the French Jews are leaving France and going to Israel. Where else is there to go? And that will be the same for us. Uh, if things change, uh, where else is there to go? So, better hold on and help Israel as much as you possibly can because that's the last resort that you have. Period.

CRANE: Have you been there?

KRAVETZ: No. My kids have all gone. I go through them. I'm not a traveler. 00:55:00I, uh, I don't fly, and, uh, had a bad experience, so I haven't flown in, I don't know, thirty years I guess. But my kids have all gone. My grandson has been there three times. And I live through them.

CRANE: Stanley, tell me about these two pictures that you have.

KRAVETZ: That's my father, Isaac Kravetz. That was taken when he was in the Russian army. As you can see, he's in uniform. This is a painting from an old picture that he had. Uh, he was, uh--he was in--in the, uh, in the Russian army. That was, uh, I don't know, maybe 1917, 19-something in that--in that era. And, uh, this is my grandfather. Very handsome man. You need more light 00:56:00or something?

CRANE: Probably less light. I'm trying--

KRAVETZ: Well we can get over there, if you want. There's more light there.

CRANE: That's okay.

KRAVETZ: This is Nathan Kravetz, my grandfather.

CRANE: Oh wow.

KRAVETZ: That was taken in Russia. He was a very handsome man. He was, uh, the blacksmith.

CRANE: Wow.

KRAVETZ: Um, do you want to -----------(??)?

CRANE: Well, Stanley, this has been wonderful. And, before we close, I want--I took a picture of your tzitzit? Is that what you call them?

KRAVETZ: Tzitzit, yeah.

CRANE: Tzitzit. Will you just tell me what that was and when you wore it. It's a little--looks like a little boy's--

KRAVETZ: Yeah, well when I was very young. (laughs) I couldn't get my arm in it now. But, it's something that you wore all the time. It hung out of your clothes. The tzitzit, the, uh, the strings would hang out, and, uh, Orthodox Jews still--they all wear that, but, uh, of course when I grew out of it I never got another one, so--but it's something--it's a--it's a ritual thing that you wear, that--you wear it all the time.

CRANE: And did you wear this when you went to school?

KRAVETZ: No.

CRANE: In Scott County? You didn't have to wear it to go to school?

KRAVETZ: No. This was on the farm when I was little. No, no. (laughs) That's all I needed at the time.

CRANE: Okay. Thank you, so much, Stanley. This has been great.

KRAVETZ: Okay. Thank you. It was a pleasure.

[End of interview.]