Interview with Beulah Collins, September 19, 1984

 COLLINS: I took care of my mother and father after they got old, couldn't work. I had a home down in the country. And when they got so they couldn't work, then I came up here with my, they passed, and I came up here with my sister and got an apartment on 15th street because I couldn't stay down there and be comfortable in my home any longer. And I stayed there with her until I couldn't take care of her. I was failing all the time. And I put her in a nursing home, and she's in that nursing home now. I call her occasionally and see how she is. I'm her guardian.

HARDY: All right. Now when you first came to Philadelphia in 1917, 1918? It had to be the year after your husband died, he died in 1918.

COLLINS: Yes, yes uh, um. We'd only been married, we weren't married quite a year, that's right.

HARDY: Now can you tell me what brought you up that first time?

COLLINS: Why yes, I just need time to think. Well, my baby was born a few months after his father died. And of course, he died in the service. And his leaving me and I was going to have this baby, my health was bad. And I had older brothers and sisters that my father had by his first wife. And they encouraged me-- they 00:02:00were living in Wilmington-- and they encouraged me to come North. They thought I would, since I was able to work a little, that I if I come to North, I could work and go to the hospital and take treatments and get better. I took their advice. That's how come I come to the North.

HARDY: Had you heard anything about Philadelphia before you came?

COLLINS: No, I stopped in Wilmington because I had a half-sister living there. My father was married before and he had two sons and a daughter and she was up here in Wilmington working. And she was working with Mr. Wilson. And he was the 00:03:00president of the Wilson Steamboat Line that went from Philadelphia to Wilmington. I don't remember the address but it was out on Clayton Street in Wilmington. She stopped with some friends and got me to stop there and I got a little job not far from there and I worked in there a little bit and went and took treatments. That's how come I got to Philadelphia, really. To come North, really, because my health was bad.

HARDY: Now, how long did you stay in Wilmington then, before you came to Philadelphia?

COLLINS: I stayed there some little time-- I'm trying to think. I had somebody 00:04:00to take care of my son. I worked not far from where I lived, people there took care of my mom. I forget the street. It was called Sayrles Street then and they called it later Delmar Place. I think that's got the name today, I think it is.

HARDY: So would you say you were there a couple months, couple of years?

COLLINS: I'd guess a couple of years.

HARDY: A couple of years. And then you came up to Philadelphia after that?

COLLINS: And then I came up to Philadelphia, yeah.

HARDY: Why did you leave Wilmington to come up to Philadelphia?

COLLINS: Well, I thought I could get better money. I came up here and got in a private job. And these, I guess, were wealthy people. I didn't consider that day- I often think of that. I didn't consider how wealthy they were because they 00:05:00would always look at the prices. And I often think of that today. Those rich people that had money was just as careful about their buying as I was. For sales, Mrs. Richard, if she was going to buy her toilet paper, she had gotten great big cases of toilet paper and had it put in the storeroom. I couldn't understand it, but I often think of it. Because she was getting that toilet paper by getting a whole lot of it maybe for five or six cents a roll while we were paying ten and fifteen cents! They knew how to save. I often think of that today. And I didn't realize they were rich. She used to say, "Beulah, we have to get this and have to get together and watch for this--" but that's how they saved their money. They are that way today! Watching the sales, yeah, and 00:06:00saving' their money. And we, poor people don't think about it. We go and get toilet paper for ten, fifteen, twenty cents for a roll of toilet paper and she gets a great big case of it and puts it in the store room cabinet, and I guess she pays five or six cents for it.

HARDY: So you came up to Philadelphia because you thought you'd get better wages. Can you tell me how you got your first job up here?

COLLINS: Why, yes. One of my half brothers had his home, this home was on Taylor Street. And when I went to work at this place-- one of my brother's had this 00:07:00home on Taylor Street-- and he had a wife that he married that come from Durham-- no not Durham-- that come from Suffolk, Virginia, came up here. And they worked for Mrs. Richard's sister. When I came up here and I wanted a job, they said to me, "Beulah, we're working for Mrs. Shearer--" it was man and wife working together and she wants a maid, so maybe you can go there and live. Sure. So I said I would try and I went there and was with Mrs. Richard for thirteen 00:08:00years. Helped to raise her two boys. She had two boys, no girls, no girls, just two boys. Because she, her husband was in the service but he had an office in the service-- now what was Mr. Richard-- Mr. Richard was-- I'm trying to think where were they from, now? North Carolina? No, but somebody was speaking of that today.

HARDY: Were they Southerners?

COLLINS: No. Mrs. Richard's father was Italian and 00:09:00he had-- now let's see-- oh I forget all that.

HARDY: Ah, that doesn't matter. So you got the job through your sister in law who worked for her sister. Now when you worked, that was live in work? Were you the only maid? The only help? So, what was your job then?

COLLINS: All over the place! Only um, when I first went there, she would have one woman come in once a week and do the regular cleaning. Then when times get tight, she called it getting' tight, she cut out that woman. And I would then do the upstairs so much one week, then the general cleaning downstairs to make it 00:10:00lighter for me. Because I was only helping that house.

HARDY: Was it a big house?

COLLINS: Well, it was three stories.

HARDY: Was that hard work? That live in work?

COLLINS: Well, I was young and could get around. I didn't consider it so hard because I had come from the country where it was hard and I just felt like I had fallen in luck, don't you know? The kind of work wasn't so hard, because when I was raised in the country I was out on the farm, on the country, and was out there and I had my baby. And we'd work during the day, and these friends of mine what worked for her sister, we had clubs that we went to and I was young and I enjoyed myself, yeah. Life was pretty easy.

HARDY: So, doing this work was a lot easier than it was on the farm?

COLLINS: Yeah! And I was young too. I was in my 30s then. Because I was married at 25 and my baby was born at 26, see? And I was young. Young folks can do a whole lot more than I can do today. Jump around, do this, work all day. And in the afternoon after I would get my dishes washed and things, dishes, I would go up and take a little nap and dress off and look at the maids now on the television, dressed like I used to dress with the white cap, white collar, apron on-- get dressed and get ready and serve dinner. I was younger then but I couldn't do it now. I can't serve myself now like I ought to.

HARDY: So what were your hours like then?

COLLINS: I guess I got up about half past seven. First thing, I'd go down the 00:12:00straight-- and sweep the front walk and the hall. Mrs. Richard liked the walk. But anyhow I had the lunch, the breakfast for them boys for them to get the train and go to school. She had two boys. And before -- I guess I'm ahead of my story a bit -- before she lived there, her husband, now where was he? California. He had a job in California. And they moved from there and went to Philadelphia. Because She used to have a lot of her things in the storage room 00:13:00from when she moved from California. And I was just trying to say… she used to call, she used to often call the name of where she lived, but I can't think of it now.

HARDY: Yeah, it doesn't matter. So you'd get up by 7:00am, get the boys off to work, to school, scrub the-- So um, you started around 7:30 in the morning. When would you be done in the evening?

COLLINS: Oh, I'd get through maybe-- I think we had dinner around seven o'clock, six I guess, but anyhow I was still in there and by eight, I'd get washed and had the evening to myself. I go with my crowd then. (Claps!) They'd come by and 00:14:00we had social clubs and things. And I'd stay out. I was young! I think of myself now. I would stay out until eleven or twelve o'clock. I guess that's the reason I look so young today because I would get home and take my rest. We never drank strong drinks or nothin'. You couldn't do that around those people. You had to be on the job. Uh um, we had a sleep in job but we had certain hours and things like that.

HARDY: So you were on duty about thirteen hours a day.

COLLINS: Yes.

HARDY: That's a good long time.

COLLINS: Yes.

HARDY: That's a good long time. A lot longer than you would out in public work.

COLLINS: Yes- only we did have, as I started to say, we did have some time off to go and get washed and dressed before dinner-- a couple hours. I would go up in my room and get dressed.

HARDY: Now where was the Taylor's residence, what part of town did they live in?

COLLINS: You mean my brother-in-law?

HARDY: No, the Richard's, I'm sorry.

COLLINS: Chestnut Hill.

HARDY: Chestnut Hill?

COLLINS: 2-- Now what was that-- Chestnut Hill-- 7810 Lincoln Drive. You know anything about Philadelphia?

HARDY: Yeah, I know where that is.

COLLINS: 7810 Lincoln Drive, Chestnut Hill. That's where I stayed and worked for Mrs. Richard for thirteen years. At the same address. I passed that sometime now. My son takes me out there and we passed that. It's a colored section now, but then it wasn't nothin' but rich white people lived up there. And they went further on up beyond what they, this was Chestnut Hill, then they went up beyond the station there-- the boulevard. I can't think about it now, but it was up in there.

HARDY: And you said after you got off work, you mean they let you go out and you would socialize with friends?

COLLINS: Yes, I had my own key to get in.

HARDY: And these were also women who were doing live in work? Did you all ever talk about doing live in work? Ever-- the thing I'm trying to find out about is how people felt about this sort of work.

[Interview interruption.]

HARDY: So, you liked your work, then?

COLLINS: Yes I liked it because it was a change.

HARDY: What did you like about it?

COLLINS: Well, it was a change from what I was used to. Because I was raised on the farm with chickens and things like that. And taken from that, food was brought right to the door. Mrs. Richard would get up and telephone and say what she wanted. The man was Mr. Reel. I think that's his name. He lived there on… I forget. I guess-- Oh what was that street called? Not Lincoln, we lived on Lincoln drive. The trolley went all the way up there.

HARDY: Well Germantown Ave--

COLLINS: Yeah, Germantown Avenue, that's it. And it was a store up there on the corner, on Germantown Avenue. Mr. Reel, he was a Jew-- no he wasn't. I don't know what nationality he was. But that's why Mrs. Richard used to get her food called up there. And he'd send it to her. She got the best of the food. Had the best of food to eat. And I just liked it. And found friends. I didn't have my car, but these other friends did have a car and we would go out at nights and stay and have a good time. But, we socialized in a nice way, not-- We didn't drink and didn't get drunk, couldn't weaver on our job when we said. Rest of 'em was like us. I just found my pal. When I went to Mrs. Richard, I remember I said 00:19:00to her, "Do you want references?" I'm ahead of my story. Because-- what did I say to her? I guess I'm a little ahead of my story--

Because the woman I worked for a few months, that's right -- I forgot I had worked a few months out in--

HARDY: Out in Ardmore?

COLLINS: Ardmore, something like that-- Mrs. Okeah(sp?). Had a big farm. Mrs. Okeah was fairly wealthy. She was, and I felt that she would give me reference if I would need them. Well, I asked Mrs. Richard if she wanted references. She 00:20:00said, "No, Beulah, I talked to Mrs. Okeah and she told me that she didn't know anything too good to say about you" So, that made me feel good so I stayed there. Thirteen years. I talked to her son, ain't been long. The oldest one passed. Do you know anything about Philadelphia?

HARDY: A bit

COLLINS: Well I'll tell you who her oldest son married. Burpee! The seed man. The oldest son married into them. Dick, he called him Dick. He was named for his father. They had one daughter. I went to see Dick married. I know when I come to the church because I passed there sometime now. That's who he married.

HARDY: Now when you came to this city, did you have any troubles adjusting city life? You came right on the farm-- you didn't have much experience with urban ways, those sorts of things. With urban ways, city ways, you know, life in the city.

COLLINS: No, because I got in with the right gang. Got with my brother and friends and wife and his people. And I felt right in the life. Didn't have no trouble.

HARDY: What to you was the most interesting thing about the city or the hardest thing to learn?

COLLINS: I guess I didn't go very far by myself on the trolley. I depended on my 00:22:00friends coming where they were going. I said where we were going, where are you going. "Well Beulah, we're going such and such a place," it would be the same people. It would be the people who worked just like we did. You know, you find your friends. Most of 'em worked in private family. Man and- most of them worked man and wife though.

HARDY: Oh yeah?

COLLINS: Most of 'em were man and wife, but Mrs. Richard lived in a small house and they made out with one maid. And as I said, when I first pointed out she had somebody come in once a week to do the regular cleaning. But as she called it getting' tight, she cut out that.

HARDY: So did your work increase when that person who came in once a week left? Did you get more work when that person left?

COLLINS: Yes, I got more work, but it was adjusted pretty good. 'Cause the boys were young and played out a lot and pulled they skates off at the back door and things like that. She taught them to be neat.

HARDY: What was the pay?

COLLINS: Oh for what? She paid me $13 a week. A week! I won't forget that. I think she raised me a little bit, but I- she started me at $13.

HARDY: What did you think, how did you feel about that?

COLLINS: Well, I made myself satisfied because I had just come from the country 00:24:00where we wasn't gettin' nothin'. And I had this child to take care of. I thought, a woman not far from where I lived and not far from the school, that kept children. She had other children and she took care of my boy. And she trained them all to call her Mom Taylor. She happened to be a Taylor too. Right? All they had to do, they tore down those homes now. I happened to pass there. Got little projects or something-- smaller homes. And this school was at 24th and Jefferson, there. You know that area?

HARDY: I know that area. Yeah I can't think of the school but I know the area.

COLLINS: Well, that's where my boy first went to school. Right 'cross from 00:25:00there, is where they lived but the home is tore down. And my days off, I never paid for a room in my life. --My days off. We'd have-- Most all the help had Thursdays off. And my days off, I would go down to Mom Taylor where my boy was, eat my lunch and spend my time there. I never paid for a room. When I had any time off, I would just give it to my boy… to be with him.

HARDY: Right. How did you feel about leaving him there? Did he stay there the full thirteen years that you were with the Richards?

COLLINS: Most of the time. As he got older, he went to another school. But most of the time he grew up-- then as he got older-- let me see-- he went to another 00:26:00school. He went to Central. And in the meantime let me see-- he went to Central-- and he had gotten bigger-- Mom Taylor passed, I was just trying to think what I did after Mom Taylor passed and Mose passed. I don't know what my boy did then.

HARDY: Was he still in High School or did he go to college then?

COLLINS: No he didn't-- he didn't go to college. But he went-- after Central, then it's another school-- I can't think of what it is though. Where is that-- I'm so forgetful. Central is a High School isn't it?

HARDY: Yeah that's the high school, yeah.

COLLINS: Where is that located?

HARDY: Right down town there. I forget exactly. But that's the best of the public boys schools.

COLLINS: Well, when he left there, he went to a school up on Broad Street-- now what's this-- right off from-- oh, what is that cross at Broad Street? Right 00:28:00near-- oh, I can't think no more-- right near a hospital.

HARDY: Ah, it doesn't matter. Now, when he grew up, you said, what did he do when he grew up? What job did he have?

COLLINS: Went to the Navy Yard

HARDY: Went to the Navy Yard? So he worked in the Navy Yard and that's what he did for a living?

COLLINS: Yeah, until he retired. That's been until about three years ago.

HARDY: Well that's a good living.

COLLINS: He is 60-- he be 67 this December.

HARDY: You got grandchildren?

COLLINS: Oh yeah! I got grandchildren and a great grandchild. He married-- he married-- twice. He has one daughter and four boys by the first wife. And by the last wife, he has two boys. I have six grandchildren-- seven grandchildren. Then I have great grandchildren. I think I have about fourteen great grandchildren.

HARDY: So you are doing well!

COLLINS: Yep. From that one boy.

HARDY: Was Mom Taylor from the South or from Philadelphia?

COLLINS: I don't remember.

HARDY: How about most of the people you socialized with after work?

COLLINS: They were from the South, yeah.

HARDY: All Southerners?

COLLINS: I guess that's one reason why I fell in line with them. Most of them was from Suffolk down there in Virginia.

HARDY: In Virginia?

COLLINS: Some of them was from Maryland.

HARDY: So they knew each other from back home, then?

COLLINS: Um hm.

HARDY: So you all didn't out with Philadelphians?

COLLINS: No, very very seldom.

HARDY: Why was that?

COLLINS: Well, I don't know why. I guess because we were satisfied with what we had. I don't remember socializing in my young day with Philadelphia people.

HARDY: Were most of the people then who did service work up in Chestnut Hill, most of them were Southerners? The ones you knew?

COLLINS: The ones I knew, um hm.

HARDY: Now, doing that sort of work in a private home, you know, it would seem that if you got a good family to work for, your situation could be really very 00:31:00good. Well if you got a bad family to work for, it could be terrible. You're living there, you know long hours-- a lot of friction, no one to turn to--. Did you ever talk about that with your friends?

COLLINS: No, no.

HARDY: So most of them were pretty well satisfied with their jobs?

COLLINS: And if they didn't have, they had left their people, relatives, at home down South, you see. Of course, I lost my people. My people died. And I believe the others I associated with, most of them were getting along. I believe their people had passed and I guess they went North to get good jobs like I had.

HARDY: Did you ever have desire to go back to Maryland?

COLLINS: No.

HARDY: Why not?

COLLINS: Well, I did go back a while with my father and mother, 'cause I had a place down there to take care of them. But I never made myself satisfied to stay there. 'Cause it was too hard. I went down there, I had a little place and I would go down there for a while-- my grandchildren would come down there and stay with me through the summer like that, but to go down there and live content-- I didn't. I got up North here.

HARDY: When you were young and with the Richards, did you ever dream about the future, about what things would be like 10 years, what things would be like when you were old, or what you wanted for yourself, for your son?

COLLINS: No, I don't think I did. Well, I wanted my son to have an education more than I had. Because I don't have much of an education. That's the thing I regret today. You give me this paper with all the words that I can't pronounce.

HARDY: All right.

COLLINS: I wanted him to have an education. And he graduated from two schools and got this job at the Navy Yard and stayed there until he retired. He has his home now at 243 East Upsal Street. He's been there for years.

HARDY: So he got his education.

COLLINS: He went through two schools. He's got his paper and he can read. He 00:34:00listens at the television so he knows what it's all about. I'm happy about that because I don't know that. Lot of these words here I can't pronounce.

HARDY: What sort of education did you have when you were young?

COLLINS: I think far as I went was the sixth grade in public school. I had one teacher there. I often think of her. We were allowed to have prayer then in our schools. And she read the scripture lesson. All of that's been taken out. I often think about that. I often think about that. How sad it is. Now, what harm did it do to have the Bible read and read the scripture lesson when God give us all to us?

HARDY: I don't know. Why did you leave school after sixth grade?

COLLINS: Well, I helped to take care of my mother and father. They were getting old. Down on this place.

HARDY: So you left school to take care of your parents?

COLLINS: Helped to take care of them. They were getting old.

HARDY: Were you a religious person when you were young?

COLLINS: Yeah. I was raised in a religious home. I was looking at my papers just yesterday. I got, last night, I got a little book that I got-- I used to have a lockbox at the bank. But when I got so that I couldn't travel backwards and forwards I had to close that box. And I got a little bag home down in my drawer, right there where my private papers are, my will, my obituary, and different 00:36:00things, don't you know, that's written put there in this box. What did you ask me? I got off the subject.

HARDY: Oh um, whether you were a religious person.

COLLINS: That's what it was-- Yes, I was raised in a Christian home. I'm religious even till now.

HARDY: When you came to Philadelphia, did you join a church right away?

COLLINS: Oh yeah, oh yeah. I joined, the first church I joined to was right across from where my brother lived on Ridge Avenue. You know anything about Philadelphia? Right opposite from Taylor Street. It was a little church-- on Ridge Ave, right opposite Taylor Street. I went there for a while. Then after a while-- I keep hearing that phone [Phone ringing in background] and think it's for me. And I went up in Chestnut Hill to work for Mrs. Richard and these 00:37:00families that I told you that work for her people, they attended another church at 20th and Dauphin. That was a Methodist church and I went there. And later on when I used to be--let me see--I guess I'm kind of ahead of my story a little bit--I went to church at 20th and Dauphin. And in the meantime-- I know-- after Mom Taylor passed I decided to get a home for my boy and I near Mrs. Richards. I got this home. And me and my boy lived there. And I attended church at 20th and 00:38:00Dauphin. Later on, let's see--

HARDY: So you stopped-- After Mom Taylor died, you bought a home or you rented a place?

COLLINS: I rented. Never owned a home in Philadelphia.

HARDY: Did you live in or out?

COLLINS: I worked out, but I got a home for my boy after he growed up.

HARDY: So he was out of school by then, he had started to work by then. Were you 00:39:00able to save anything on $13 per week?

COLLINS: No. No, that's the reason I ain't got nothing now. Everything was hand to mouth. I don't think anybody saved anything. I, my boy, he was able to pay for his home and things like that. I told you where I lived, up on German Street. And he-- his older children are working. The oldest boy--two of the boys--worked for Butts. You know Butts? Automobile man.

HARDY: Right

COLLINS: The two oldest boys. One of them is named Andrew. Andrew the Third and the other one is Wade Collins. They worked there. Quite nice boys, my 00:40:00grandchildren is lovely to me.

HARDY: That's good to have good family around.

COLLINS: And when they were growing up, I never saved anything. When they would have a birthday, I tried to give them a bond on their birthday. And they appreciate that now. I don't know. I say, they may have saved those bonds and drawing interest.

HARDY: So you yourself were not able to save anything on that 13.00 a week. Were you able make ends meet on it? Pay your bills?

COLLINS: Well, I watched the sales and bought cheap stockings. I remember going down to Lits [Department Store] trying to get this that and the other. I watched the sales. Some of the shoes I used to wear, I can't wear any more. Had to bring 00:41:00my heels down as I got older.

HARDY: All right. How about your friends, other friends from the South? Were any of them ever able to save anything?

COLLINS: I don't know because most of them are gone. Most of them went back to the South. I don't think any of my old friends that I knew when I was with Mrs. Richard are around now. Most of the friends that I know now is the ones that's in the church where I go.

HARDY: What church are you a member of now?

COLLINS: Mt. Olive Holy Temple. Do you know where that is? Broad and Jefferson.

HARDY: Broad and Jefferson, OK, I do know where that is.

COLLONS: Bishop Webb is the pastor. It's a holiness church. Later on I came in 00:42:00holiness. He said be ye holy as I am holy. So later on getting' higher and higher, I became in holiness. And I'm glad I'm there 'cause I read His word. Keeps you reading' His word. I read His word. Stay in the word.

HARDY: Were there any differences in the churches between where you came from in Maryland and Philadelphia? Different style preachers or people behave any differently?

COLLINS: No, I can't say. There were maybe a few people down there that didn't behave themselves because I know sometime, I get talking to people up here and they say, even right here in the South, "Oh, I don't want Maryland, I don't want 00:43:00Maryland for my home." Because that's where they hang people. See, they look at the old part, they don't look at the good part. It was a man down there that was hung, I remember. Way out in the woods somewhere. They made a gallows and hung him. And one of my niece's offspring married that boy-- married that man. And he was a good farmer and lived on the farm. And worked for one of the wealthiest men on the farm. When he was hung, they took that child and raised it. I remember-- Asbury Dixon. And some of these people here say, "Don't want to go 00:44:00down there in Maryland. That's where they hung that man." They are throwing that back at me. I said, "But there is some good people down there." They don't look at that, you see.

HARDY: The Eastern Shore had a reputation for being a pretty rough place for colored people. You know back in the day when you were young. Was there, uh, did you have to, did you all fear lynching or have to keep to the straight and narrow?

COLLINS: Oh yeah, we feared it. Very careful.

HARDY: Tell me about it.

COLLINS: Well, that same man what was hung, he was a kind of rough life. There were several of those men and they seemed to be a little different from the rest. They were Dixon's. And He was drinking. And I know his wife used to go to town, sometime. And they had a child named Teemer. The one I told you the white 00:45:00people raised. And his wife used to leave this baby at my mother's house for her to keep while she go to town. Everybody went to town on a Saturday afternoon to do their shopping. And, but I said that to say this, that people looks at the bad side. But they got some good people down there in Maryland.

COLLINS: These people tell me that I don't want to go down in Maryland! They done killed Asbury and hung him down there. It's true.

HARDY: What did they hang him for?

COLLINS: He shot a woman. He was-- His wife had died. I think that she died and he was living with another woman. And she was pregnant and they had a row or 00:46:00something. 'Cause when he got drunk, he --you know-- row, row. And he shot her and killed her and then they killed him. That's what that was about.

HARDY: Was it-- you say that when you grew up, you did fear lynching. What did the local whites do to-- I'm wondering what were the relations were like between the two races, colored and white, when you were growing up, a young girl in Maryland?

COLLINS: Well, I think the white thought they were better than the colored. They considered us poor, under like slaves and you do this and you do that and I'm above you. Well, they have a little bit of that in the North when I come here 00:47:00because Mrs. Richard put me down to $13.00 a week. She wasn't going to give me all she could give me. That goes with white people right up here today. They ain't going to give us what they give white people. They wouldn't give us what they would give their sister or brother. They just got something against colored people. The black race. Don't you think so?

HARDY: Oh no question about it. And you found that in Philadelphia too?

COLLINS: Yes, the black skin. And yet, they want us to work for them. But, you ain't too black to work for them! You ain't too black to get down there and scrub that kitchen, wash their dishes-- but you're too, too black. There's just 00:48:00something about that black skin. They don't consider that God made us all.

HARDY: Yeah, I guess there is always the tendency to treat people who are different much more poorly than you would treat your own.

COLLINS: Well, one good thing, I'm glad that about God don't have no respect for person.

HARDY: Colored blind, hm.

COLLINS: Un huh.

HARDY: Following up on this, did you have some resentment against Mrs. Richard for the low wages she gave you?

COLLINS: No, I guess I just in a way that I made myself satisfied because that's 00:49:00the way others was being' treated. You see what I mean? If she had give me $13, and give my friends a whole lotta more, or their people had given them a whole lotta more, I would have been. But we were treated alike. And I made myself satisfied.

HARDY: So when everybody else is making the same amount of money--

COLLINS: They had no chance to save nothing, just like me.

HARDY: Did you all ever talk about that together?

COLLINS: No, I don't think so. Just took what we had and did the best we could.

HARDY: Did you ever go and ask her for a raise?

COLLINS: No. I don't think I ever did.

HARDY: Why not?

COLLINS: Well, I guess the reason why I didn't ask her for a raise for more, I didn't ask for none, I guess because my brothers and sisters were just like me. They were getting about the same. If I had asked her for a raise, she might have kicked and says, "Well, your brother, your Elizabeth and Oxford which were the friends that worked for her sister, they are satisfied and they go to this place 00:51:00and the other place. Why should you want more?" She might have kicked, I don't know. I just made myself satisfied.

HARDY: So you didn't want to risk--

COLLINS: No! I don't know.

Even now. Take me now. Here in this center. I look at the people when they come in getting things for nothing. When we go to the table and eat, I look at some of them people-- the kick about this and kick about that. And they ain't paying nothing. Some of them, the coffee. Well, the coffee is good. I love that coffee. But I just draw a little illustration about the coffee. But those potatoes--well, they got one-- the peas wasn't done, the rice pudding was hard.

HARDY: It's always a lot easier to complain about something you didn't have to pay for.

COLLINS: Yeah. Ain't paying a thing for it. Hard to suit.

HARDY: Ah, you know, I find that with my kids. If they get a whole lot, they don't appreciate what they have. Right? I think the less you have, the tendency to appreciate it more.

COLLINS: Yeah. So, I just made myself satisfied. I'm that way here now. Not that I'm boasting. But I do not complain. You don't hear them say that Beulah Collins does not like this or doesn't like that. Anything Beulah Collins don't like, I push it aside. Now we had something today that--

HARDY: Let me take you back, OK? We're going to have to leave pretty soon, so I 00:53:00want to get as much as I can out of you while I got you. Now you wore a livery, you wore a uniform? How did you feel about that?

COLLINS: Um hm, just liked to be called--[ ]. I was working for them what pleased them. And my friends was doing the same thing.

HARDY: Did you serve dinners?

COLLINS: Oh yeah. That's what I put on. In the morning, I had the blue dress, colored dress that I wore in the morning. Different from your clothes. Maybe they did your underclothes, I don't remember that. But your uniforms they did. And in the evenings for dinner--after you went up and dressed a while--you put on a black dress with white collar and white cuffs. Well, some of them wore a 00:54:00cap but Mrs. Richard didn't demand a cap. But she had a white apron, I often see them on television just like we used to wear. It pleased her and I was taking her money and I made myself satisfied.

HARDY: I guess you can have pride in that. Did you ever think about doing any other types of work?

COLLINS: No. Because I had my boy to take care of and I was getting along alright with that. I didn't have no husband to depend on. So I just made myself satisfied. It's all that I know today.

HARDY: It's a good way to do it, to be happy with whatever conditions you have-- 00:55:00it's probably why you've lived this long.

COLLINS: I don't know what other type of work I could do.

HARDY: Well, factory work, laundry work--I know some women preferred to do the factory work because then when their job was done at end of day it was done.

COLLINS: Well, what would I do in a factory? Peel tomatoes? I remember a long time when I was a child we did used to work in a tomato factory. That was before I ever come to the city.

HARDY: So all in all, how do you feel now? Many years later after your move north to Philadelphia?

COLLINS: Feel perfectly contented. Don't have anything to regret because what I 00:56:00did, I did with honest heart. And the one's I was employed with, I tried to please them and they seemed to be satisfied with me. So when you are satisfied with me, that makes me satisfied with you, what I got to do. Even if I go down there in the kitchen, I fold napkins. I can't do nothing else but that now! I want to do something and I volunteer to fold napkins. And when I get through my little coffee and toast every morning, you can ask any of them down there in the kitchen-- I go back down and ask if there is any napkins to be fold. That's my job. They say yeah, we got something for ya. And if they don't, I come upstairs and when they get those napkins, they call, "Beulah," one girl calls me Aunt 00:57:00Beulah, "We got something for ya." And I know what it mean. And I go on down there. I love my job.

HARDY: That's good. Did you ever go to the Standard Theatre?

COLLINS: I don't think so. Standard. I used to hear of that. What did they do there?

HARDY: Well that was theater owned and operated by man named Gibson, a colored man. Owned and operated by colored people, down on South Street.

COLLINS: Well, we never went to the movies. That's the reason why I don't understand these movies when they put them on here.

HARDY: What did you do when you went out with friends?

COLLINS: Laugh and talk. Make plans about going to church or something like 00:58:00that. I never went to the movies.

HARDY: Ever go to restaurants or to nightclubs or other sorts of things?

COLLINS: No, sometimes when we had our day off. We'd have a half a day off. Most of us it was on Thursdays. We'd go and have dinners together somewhere or something like that. But to have or go to a theatre or movie-- they put movies on here and I don't even understand them.

HARDY: So you had no interest to go to the theaters back then? Huh, that's interesting because a lot of people did like to go to the Lincoln, or the Standard, or the Royal--

COLLINS: I used to hear of them, but not my gang. We didn't go. Maybe some of our children went. I think my son-- I know the grandchildren goes to theatres. 00:59:00Movies-- one day one of them come here to see me and they saw the machine and said, "Oh Grandmom, you have movies." There was a machine there and I didn't know what it was.

HARDY: How about the radio? Did you listen to the radio? Do you remember the first time you heard of a radio?

COLLINS: Lord, it's been so long. Let me see about a radio. I have a radio now. I love a radio now. Do you ever listen to that family radio?

HARDY: What's that one?

COLLINS: You get it on the FM dial. It's religious family radio that run 24 hours a day. I keep my radio right on that 106 and all you got to do is go over there and turn it. And I'm one-- now what would you call that-- donates to that. 01:00:00That's where my own little bit goes now. It's to help spread the Word so it will go to all the world-- preaches the gospel.

HARDY: You are Methodist?

COLLINS: I'm in Holiness now. I was born Methodist. And then another one is-- now you see he is right there in North Carolina-- Jim Baker. Ever hear of him? He come on at 9 o'clock in the morning.

HARDY: Nope, don't know him.

COLLINS: Well, he's a religious man.

HARDY: I'd like to take a couple of pictures of you.

COLLINS: Oh, boy. Well, I expect you broke that!

HARDY: No, you look pretty good! For 92, you are in extremely good shape. 01:01:00Attractive woman.

COLLINS: Thank you.

HARDY: Now, OK. Well, I think your bus is going to be taking you up pretty soon.

COLLINS: What time is it?

HARDY: About 2:30. So I should probably let you go.

[BREAK IN AUDIO]

COLLINS: [singing]

We're moving up the King's Highway

It's a highway to heaven,

None can walk up there, but the pure at heart

It's a highway to heaven

I'm walking up the King's Highway.

If you are not walking, start while I'm talkin'

Walking up the King's Highway,

There is no one doubting, I'm -----

I'm walking up the King's Highway.

It's a highway to…

[End of interview.]